Hello Fellow Yuneec Pilot!
Join our free Yuneec community and remove this annoying banner!
Sign up

A bit more info on the 520 and camera

Having worked a lot with high magnification cameras on aerial gimbals it was easy to predict what the Peau lens would experience on the H gimbal. There would be some stabilization issues with video. More glass = more weight. Using that as a comparison for the 520 my initial thoughts for the 520 has it as something best used for inspection work, where stills are of greater value than video. The ability to stand a little further off and capture good detail is quite beneficial, especially when an image would be used for study, not entertainment. I suspect the lens on the CI is not too much different from the Peau, and adding adaptive smoothing to the camera software could clean up the video.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Eyewingsuit
Stabilization won't help much with longer focal lengths. The complaint will be about either image softness (a by-product of stabilization whether EIS or OIS) or complaints about jitter/movement. Flying at high speeds or fast movement with a longer focal length lens will always create problems with these smaller (and even larger) systems. it takes a different touch to fly a longer focal length, regardless of whose lens it is. Perhaps the best simile would be that you don't use a framing hammer the same way you'd use a ball peen hammer, although they're both hammers.

^^^^ Pat R said it better. :)
 
I think you covered it rather well, especially relative to softness. It requires some pretty high end software and lot of computational power to compensate for even very small issues with stabilization at longer focal lengths when the cameras in relatively high speed motion.

Something that can be truly aggravating is trying to pull a clear screen shot from a video that was using that kind of stabilization software. They often come out pretty bad, especially when at high magnification levels. I just don't see a consumer drone ever achieving a level of sophistication capable of producing high magnification clear imagery while still being even a little affordable for 95% of the typical buyers or these things. I think Clint Eastwood said it best when he said "A man's gotta know his limitations".


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Eyewingsuit
Perhaps sometime in the future we will have true optical stabilization built into cameras of this size.
 
That is only good for only so much. Look at the high end DSLR's for a cost basis we would have to deal with. If willing to spend enough money we can have nearly anything. That's the rub. People buying what we have would not be very receptive to paying $6k and up for the product they think they should be able to produce. They can absolutely do it now but I don't see a long line of people waiting to buy an Alta with a MoVi. They aren't there for a fairly basic 800mm hex or 8 fitted with even a budget level Arris gimbal and A7 or Canon either. They want steak on a bean budget. What you can do is totally dependent upon what you are willing to spend.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tuna
Well they have done it for many pocket cameras and even cell phone cameras. I think we will see it in these drone cameras sooner than later. It certainly won't solve all vibration issues but could definitely help with longer focal length lenses.
 
Well they have done it for many pocket cameras and even cell phone cameras. I think we will see it in these drone cameras sooner than later. It certainly won't solve all vibration issues but could definitely help with longer focal length lenses.

Don't confuse EIS value in mobile and pocket cams with what we're trying to achieve. Those devices have very short focal lengths, very stable platforms free of micro-vibration, and ultra-micro imagers. We're moving into the world of larger and larger imagers, and multi-element lenses, which is an order of magnitude greater in complexity.
 
Don't confuse EIS value in mobile and pocket cams with what we're trying to achieve. Those devices have very short focal lengths, very stable platforms free of micro-vibration, and ultra-micro imagers. We're moving into the world of larger and larger imagers, and multi-element lenses, which is an order of magnitude greater in complexity.
No these are actually optical not electronic IS. Check out the difference between the iPhone 6s (EIS) vs iPhone 6s Plus (OIS.)
 
Sometimes two systems working in tandem can get confused and make things worse, e.g. with a DLSR that has in body stabilisation, fitted with a lens that also has it they normally say you should use on or the other and not both,
 
No these are actually optical not electronic IS. Check out the difference between the iPhone 6s (EIS) vs iPhone 6s Plus (OIS.)

Yes, and the iPhone has a tiny sensor which means relatively poor dynamic range. That's why DJI have gone to a 1" sensor, and why DSLRs have large sensors.

So you can have OIS on a tiny sensor (you only have to move a small bit of glass around) or high dynamic range on a large sensor. The laws of physics are against having both, despite all the research that high end photography and imaging companies have thrown at it. Don't be fooled by Apples marketing into thinking that the iPhone has a particularly miraculous image quality - it's just better than most cell phones.
 
Sometimes two systems working in tandem can get confused and make things worse, e.g. with a DLSR that has in body stabilisation, fitted with a lens that also has it they normally say you should use on or the other and not both,
That doesn't appear to be an issue here. Check out these videos:
So, it seems possible to successfully add in-camera OIS to an external gimbal system. This might provide a steady video image from a longer focal length lens on the existing TH gimbal. Just thinking.
 
Yes, and the iPhone has a tiny sensor which means relatively poor dynamic range. That's why DJI have gone to a 1" sensor, and why DSLRs have large sensors.

So you can have OIS on a tiny sensor (you only have to move a small bit of glass around) or high dynamic range on a large sensor. The laws of physics are against having both, despite all the research that high end photography and imaging companies have thrown at it. Don't be fooled by Apples marketing into thinking that the iPhone has a particularly miraculous image quality - it's just better than most cell phones.
The iphone 6s plus has a 1/3 vs 1/2.3 sensor for the CGO3+ so not that much difference in size.
 
No these are actually optical not electronic IS. Check out the difference between the iPhone 6s (EIS) vs iPhone 6s Plus (OIS.)

you've pointed out exactly what I said. EIS/OIS in small, mobile devices is significantly easier than doing so with longer focal lengths and multi-elements.
The next round of image processors from Ambarella and Sony will offer some significant improvements in stabilization, but they'll still be EIS, not OIS.
My background in aviation started as a skydiving cameraman; trust me....I've been down the stabilization route many, many times with many, many systems. This is me, testing a variety of cameras for a particular purpose/magazine, stabilization included.

image13_l.jpg
 
I'm impressed your neck didn't snap when the chute opened.

LOL, the above system weighs NOTHING compared to carrying REDs or Alexa's.
Hardest part of this 3lb setup was the wind resistance in freefall. Deployment is no big deal.

The Panasonic 3D camera was a bit of a challenge due to leverage/CG
330259_2417480429727_279328192_o.jpg



This one snapped a bit too, again because of leverage/CG being too far forward (Shooting a promo piece for a well-known cell phone)
1524954_10202640759793499_465449765_n.jpg


This one is very heavy, but the CG is straight over my spine/neck so deployment is well-balanced (stunt work for big budget, shooting 1000fps)
1074673_10201022172729834_511429194_o.jpg



My normal/every day rig.

485458_10202640759593494_638038334_n.jpg
 
  • Like
Reactions: eric bee
@Eyewingsuit Wonderful equipment! If you're ever around my neck of the woods, feel free to drop in! (See what I did there?)

More seriously, the "If the iPhone/this action cam does it, why can't Yuneec?" comments really miss the point that the iPhone and most other action cams don't give stabilisation against multi frequency mechanical vibration whilst delivering high dynamic range images. If they did, you wouldn't see people with 3lb cameras strapped to their heads, just to take a photo :)

As the sensor sizes we talking about, everything counts - so 1/2.3 vs 1/3" sensor means nearly double the mass to move around for OIS. You only have to add a few grams to the weight of the camera and the gimbal motors have to have twice the torque and so on... it all adds up very quickly.
 
I think when it comes to stabilization on any UAV cam setup many people over look some key factors that play big roles in keeping it stable because you cannot just count solely on the vibration mount. Instead anyone that owns any UAV needs to always remember to make 100% positive that all of their blades have been properly balanced perfectly (& this is not something that anyone should need to send in to have done because if your not capable of doing this then you really need to reevaluate whether you should be even flying an sized UAV) when balancing our blades if any of you come from a RC helicopter or plane background it is not the same with our blades because if you look at our blades the pitch is variable all the way from center to outside tip so if you simply sand off material from the heavy side you'll actually be changing the pitch along with flight characteristics & even if you get it to perfectly balance as soon as you mount it back on your H & go fly you'll feel like it's flying worse than before, the proper way to not alter flight characteristics is to buy some very thin CA Glue & apply a drop of it to the light side then I like to move the blade around before it dries to kind of spread it). If you fly with out of balanced blades then seeing the vibration in your recording is by far the least of your concern cuz they will actually increase the speed of wear & tear on your motors & sooner then later make one or more fail.

Not in any of the 3 cams mentioned above but in a future to be released cam Yuneec will be releasing one that will feature a 1" CMOS Sensor which will not only give much better pics & recording in the day time but one better low light abilities. Personally rather then having Yuneec keep on releasing various cameras I'd much rather see them release their thermal cameras & then one single camera with a large 1" sensor in it that we then could be able to use it similar to the DSLR cameras of today by just pushing a button to release a lens to then be able to mount a new on that meets whatever needs we may have for that set of flight or whatever, just think about it like this in the regular camera world 2 ppl could go out & buy the same Nikon DSLR Camera but say one person is going to use his for the everyday photos & some portraits but the 2nd person is a professional court side basketball photographer. Both have a single camera but then each gets different various sized lenses that suit the purpose that each person needs them for, so subject A could own the stock lens, a portrait lens & maybe a nicer aftermarket all aroundens but subject B bought his camera as the Body only cuz he then bought a 500-1000mm lense for courtside photos, maybe he is into macro also so he buys a decent macro lens. My point being is that no matter who you may be or what your using your H for I think I'd have a consensus of everyone agreeing that they'd rather not have to carry around 3-5 different cameras so they will be ready & would much rather carry one or maybe 2 good cameras along with various lenses, this would ultimately make traveling easier, lighter & your total investment cost would not need to be so high. Because even those of you that do any kind of drone service professionally let me ask, how many times have you gotten paid vs. how many jobs have you had or how many of you have gotten paid full rate on your jobs? Even if you've been getting paid fully rate how close to having you H pay for itself are you ie (the total including any & all aftermarket mods, hop up parts including lenses & filters & any possible repair costs etc. Including any labor fees that you have spent added to the total you paid for your H then subtract the amount of money that you've earned from any & all jobs) then tell me does your final # after doing that math end up as a positive or negative # & if it's a negative # what is it? I only say this because if you truly want to do whatever it is that you do with your H as a professional service & not just a Hobby then the # you came up with out of that equation should be enough if not more to be able to buy a brand new H Pro package at the prices they where going for when you bought your not for the lower prices they are at now, this is figuring that you've downe this professionally for no less than 6 months. Because you have figure in Insurance for you, your rig & liability plus figure in how much wear & tear your bird experiences every time it flies.
 

New Posts

Members online

No members online now.

Forum statistics

Threads
20,973
Messages
241,798
Members
27,359
Latest member
drakemerch33