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Arm falls off in flight & crashed

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Our first flight today we had a shoot was only about 3 minutes of flight. The flight seems like all the other that we use team mode to capture our images. On the flight back and was about to land we had some issues then seconds later the left back arm just pops out of the socket which then caused it to crash a few seconds later

Has anyone else experienced this before with the glued it seems to just come loose and fall off. We always test the arms before take off to make sure the blades and arms are locked inn place..


 
Sounds like you've been rough handling your H by carrying it around by an extended boom for awhile. BTW, they aren't glued on.

I'd love to be a fly on the wall to watch how you've been testing the boom locks.
 
Yea this is carbon fiber, a very slight nudge is all you need to see if it's locked into place. Go to Home Depot and pick up carbon fiber kit and fix it.
 
I could be slightly mistaken, but judging by the image the carbon fiber arm came out of the lock mount. My first guess is the plastic rivet holding the arm to the mount is not there. On the bottom of the lock mount is a small circular plastic piece. This plastic piece is actually a rivet to hold the arm together. Glue alone would not have the durability to with stand up to the stresses of the airframe. 20170708_081735.jpg
 
I suspect that is the case as well. We need to remember aircraft are built to fly and are not so robust to enable continuous rough handling. From experience I know that carrying an H by an extended boom places a lot of undesirable stress on a locking clip and the structure it engages. Repeatedly lifting an H using an extended boom puts the full weight of the aircraft on a single rivet and locking clip while leveraging it at the same time. The structure was designed to lift using generally equal upwards force applied to 6 booms, not one. We need to be smart enough to understand the H is designed and constructed to be portable using a folding structure, light enough that larger, heavier motors and batteries are not necessary, and strong enough to withstand flight stresses and handling by people that are conscious of the fact that everything has a limit.

What's also apparent here is the preflight process was not as comprehensive as it could have been. The rivet didn't suddenly break and fall out. A better visual inspection would have indicated the rivet had been fretting, allowing movement, and had left traces of the movement on the outside of the mount. Seeing those traces would have alerted the user of the need for repair or maintenance. If the locking clip had also failed it likely was less secure than the other boom clips, alerting the user to further inspect the clip and repair it before the next flight.

Was the aircraft abused? Probably, but that abuse likely occurred over time without the operator aware they were abusing the structure. Lack of awareness is a common problem in RC because people fail to take the time to learn enough about what they are flying, which causes them to overlook warning indicators.
 
On the odd occasion in the past when I have not fully checked all clips before take off I have noticed that the down draft pressure just before take off is enough to make a boom click into place.
All booms are now checked as part of preflight procedures.
 
I suspect that is the case as well. We need to remember aircraft are built to fly and are not so robust to enable continuous rough handling. From experience I know that carrying an H by an extended boom places a lot of undesirable stress on a locking clip and the structure it engages. Repeatedly lifting an H using an extended boom puts the full weight of the aircraft on a single rivet and locking clip while leveraging it at the same time. The structure was designed to lift using generally equal upwards force applied to 6 booms, not one. We need to be smart enough to understand the H is designed and constructed to be portable using a folding structure, light enough that larger, heavier motors and batteries are not necessary, and strong enough to withstand flight stresses and handling by people that are conscious of the fact that everything has a limit.

What's also apparent here is the preflight process was not as comprehensive as it could have been. The rivet didn't suddenly break and fall out. A better visual inspection would have indicated the rivet had been fretting, allowing movement, and had left traces of the movement on the outside of the mount. Seeing those traces would have alerted the user of the need for repair or maintenance. If the locking clip had also failed it likely was less secure than the other boom clips, alerting the user to further inspect the clip and repair it before the next flight.

Was the aircraft abused? Probably, but that abuse likely occurred over time without the operator aware they were abusing the structure. Lack of awareness is a common problem in RC because people fail to take the time to learn enough about what they are flying, which causes them to overlook warning indicators.
Yes we are a two man crew and at times we check go behind and check each other's so yes there were two hands on the H getting it ready and we even did a calibration. This aircraft has never been crashed before.
Sounds like you've been rough handling your H by carrying it around by an extended boom for awhile. BTW, they aren't glued on.

I'd love to be a fly on the wall to watch how you've been testing the boom locks.
It was not the boom locks, it was the shaft that came out of the locks, and we use this drone in team mode with a pilot and camera operator who is a retired flight engineer, who always double checks everything before take off. Our average flight time on each mission ranges from 2-8 minutes long. So we are not doing crazy stunts with this and most of the time in flying in Safe mode which as you know does not do hard and quick maneuvers as angle mode,
 
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Sounds like you've been rough handling your H by carrying it around by an extended boom for awhile.

What's also apparent here is the preflight process was not as comprehensive as it could have been.

Was the aircraft abused?Probably

Did I not watch the same video as you? Perhaps you are correct. Perhaps his H was not inspected or handled the way you would have, but NOTHING in that video would give me (or you) the right to make such definitive assumptions
I appreciate (most of) your posts but where do you get off by making some of the assumptions that you make? I would think that most people post on here to get answers, suggestions, and advice. Not finger pointing from others who do not know the entire situation.
 
Yep, we watched the same video that repeats itself depicting the time of failure over and over. No, I don't begin to believe that what failed was the result of the one flight, it was the result of effects accumulated over numerous flights. Was it preventable? Probably. Might the defect causing the failure have been caught during pre-flight? Probably. Might the manner the aircraft is handled had an accumulated affect that initiated the failure? Absolutely, but not necessarily. Might the assembly have been defective from the beginning? Once again, absolutely, but might a well designed and executed pre-flight have caught that before actual failure? Probably, but not absolutely.

What we have is a very short video depicting a failure with almost no multi flight descriptive history or maintenance info to go with it. The general feeling related in the post is the H was not built well enough or that the glue was not strong enough or applied with enough quantity. A big question here is "What Glue?" Where is glue used to hold the H structure together? It's not, they use mechanical fasteners. We also don't have a full description of the pre-flight process. How are the booms checked for security? Are they provided a light rotational force to assure they are not loose or just wiggled up and down to establish security? We don't know. Do we know if that boom had experienced one or more tip overs that applied leveraged force on it? We don't. Most failures/incidents occur due to an accumulation of factors that over time bring failure. I'll stick with my guess being the most likely cause being a mechanically induced structural failure, with a less probable cause being a defect in workmanship, with an additional factor of inadequate pre-flight, until more evidence is provided to establish something to the contrary.

I was never a flight engineer, but I was certainly an incident investigator, and one of the tasks was performing root cause analysis. It would be nice if a lot more info was provided to establish an evidence trail for this event but lacking that I have to go with the most probable failure mode. Video from the aircraft only tells you something happened, not why it happened. Even having a separated boom does not establish the why, it only exhibits the "where".
 
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I agree with everything you said and sorry I didn't go into much detail but this is our 3rd Typhoon H and we do double checks on the blades every time to make sure its a full click, We also do a full calibration on each flight while the other person goes back and re-checks things. The H ha not been abused or tipped over we also travel with a very nice Drone Crates case that is well secured. I personal inspect the gimble rubber mounts every flight as well and make sure the arms are locked and at take off I keep my eyes on the drone then do a screen check before taking off. We both did not notice and wiggle or movement before flight or we might have noticed something. We are very aware some pilots may push the aircraft limits to see what it can do which we do not as much as others, It has also not been in flight with very much high gusty winds to cause issues to may happen. I now have a better video that you can see the full flight and see how we flew it that second up to the crash
 
Cool! That could well reverse my opinion and re-direct it towards a structural defect. If the rivet was weak and ket go the boom would eventually depart the main structure. If the boom broke at the rivet joint it would be a clear structural defect, and something we all would need to be concerned with.
 
So we are not doing crazy stunts with this and most of the time in flying in Safe mode which as you know does not do hard and quick maneuvers as angle mode,

Safe mode? I think that says it all. Please learn to fly in Angle Mode and forget about Smart Mode. Practice makes perfect.
 
You have to admit one thing though. That H tried hard to remain upright after the boom separated. Imagine it was a quad. It would have been in full blender mode instantly.
 
Cool! That could well reverse my opinion and re-direct it towards a structural defect. If the rivet was weak and ket go the boom would eventually depart the main structure. If the boom broke at the rivet joint it would be a clear structural defect, and something we all would need to be concerned with.


it seems the rivet is still in place and the arm pieces are still inside,
 

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  • Typhoon.h.carbob.fiber.arm.jpg
    Typhoon.h.carbob.fiber.arm.jpg
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I totally retract my previous and apologize for being so harsh Structural failure from vibration induced stress fracture.
 
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I totally retract my previous and apologize for being so harsh Structural failure from vibration induced stress fracture.
I understand you just never know who is legit about what happens and how they take care of their aircraft, I was mainly trying to find out on here if this is an issues in the past or is this something brand new that has never happens. So far I have spoke with Carolina Dronz and Frank now sees that we may have a case to about the part shattering over time. This is my 3rd Typhoon H and It been a little over a year I have been flying on a daily. I will let you know what yuneec does the next few days..
 
Typhoon.h.carbob.fiber.arm.jpg
I could be slightly mistaken, but judging by the image the carbon fiber arm came out of the lock mount. My first guess is the plastic rivet holding the arm to the mount is not there. On the bottom of the lock mount is a small circular plastic piece. This plastic piece is actually a rivet to hold the arm together. Glue alone would not have the durability to with stand up to the stresses of the airframe. View attachment 6524

check out this photo up close
 

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