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Drone Origin Important to U.S. Government

PatR

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PatR

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So, DJI was OK with (and, I believe, participated in) regulations based on false reasons when it looked like it would clear out thier competition.
I wonder how they feel after spending all that money lobbying the government to gain a business advantage through legislative action only to find out afterwards they were cut out of the game?

Something of note, this applies to all Chinese technology drones, not just DJI. Anyone planning on government work needs to find a US or EU maker.
 
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NorWiscPilot

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Since I don’t have a subscription, could not read the entire article. But I did see reference to a new policy allowing for some exceptions; emergencies and natural disaster response, for example.

Would be nice if a U.S. based manufacturer could obtain all U.S. made parts in order to make fully compliant aircraft to match and exceed what we can get currently. Function, reliability, and cost are the keys.

Think anyone can swoop in and make it happen? Seems opportunity is presenting itself.

By the way, I have nothing against global trade, as long as quality and the playing field is equal as it can be.

Jeff
 

PatR

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Jeff,

U.S. companies ARE making drones using U.S., Japanese, and EU sourced parts, including FC’s and code. The reason we don’t hear a lot about them is because they are not cheap like Chinese drones. The companies that make them don’t even bother advertising at consumer level because consumers won’t or can’t spend that much for a drone.

I’ve made mention of a couple of them a few times and every time readers responded negatively about the cost, while attempting cost compare with the cheap hardware they were currently flying. So people want BMW’s and Lamborghini’s at Yugo prices. They just refuse to understand that Yugo price meant much of what they hoped to get was left out.

It’s impossible for American companies to be cost competitive when their employees earn more money on a coffee break than a Chinese worker earns for the entire day. Rather than try to compete they just make much better products and price them accordingly.
 

NorWiscPilot

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Exactly my point, PatR.

The price point seems to be the deciding factor for most buyers. Curious how much of a difference it would be for an H480 equivalent from any of the manufacturers you [@PatR] have mentioned previously.

Now I have something to do today. Go searching past posts, looking for those U.S.-based companies referenced.

Thanks!

Jeff
 
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Where it is made is not a problem.
The problem is where and how software support is done.
The real issue is the Chinese government's access to DJI's flight records without a court order.
 
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PatR

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Agreed, but as one country has law mandating that all their businesses and people provide the country’s intelligence community with any collected data it becomes a country of origin issue.

Far to many Chinese electronic products, from children’s toys, security cameras, cell phones, computers, and other items have demonstrated they contain code that automatically transmits data to Chinese servers when an internet connection can be made.

Where drones are concerned, we encounter a product that is frequently used to collect imagery in one form or another of locations associated with our nation’s critical infrastructure. They can and have been used inside structures that cannot be viewed from outside the structure. If there is any possibility a drone can be linked directly with the web in any manner they become a security risk. The use of web based Apps, WiFi for RF transmission, over the air updates, or web connected “Assistant” programming establishes a means to exchange data with a foreign server. I don’t believe but a handful of consumer drone operators are aware of or have dealt with our ITAR regulations but they contain specific rules covering control of information and technology, something totally violated with uncontrolled data transmission.

Ultimately, the government order is simply a minor continuance of the digital warfare that has been in play between China, her minions, and the U.S. for over 20 years. We also need to consider that regardless of what rule or promise China has agreed to they have never complied, always finding a means to circumvent or blatantly violate them. Trust cannot be generated with entities that have a proven history of violating trust, or those that have demonstrated a desire to control the world’s economy.
 
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Agreed, but as one country has law mandating that all their businesses and people provide the country’s intelligence community with any collected data it becomes a country of origin issue.

Far to many Chinese electronic products, from children’s toys, security cameras, cell phones, computers, and other items have demonstrated they contain code that automatically transmits data to Chinese servers when an internet connection can be made.

Where drones are concerned, we encounter a product that is frequently used to collect imagery in one form or another of locations associated with our nation’s critical infrastructure. They can and have been used inside structures that cannot be viewed from outside the structure. If there is any possibility a drone can be linked directly with the web in any manner they become a security risk. The use of web based Apps, WiFi for RF transmission, over the air updates, or web connected “Assistant” programming establishes a means to exchange data with a foreign server. I don’t believe but a handful of consumer drone operators are aware of or have dealt with our ITAR regulations but they contain specific rules covering control of information and technology, something totally violated with uncontrolled data transmission.

Ultimately, the government order is simply a minor continuance of the digital warfare that has been in play between China, her minions, and the U.S. for over 20 years. We also need to consider that regardless of what rule or promise China has agreed to they have never complied, always finding a means to circumvent or blatantly violate them. Trust cannot be generated with entities that have a proven history of violating trust, or those that have demonstrated a desire to control the world’s economy.
I am picking your arguments here are based upon sound research and unequivocal evidence?
 

PatR

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Everything presented can be easily found using search engines referencing open source material. As the points are easily verifiable I’ll let those so interested spend some time in personal research in order to delve even further into Chinese business and trade deal transgressions, internet server breeches, IP theft, and balance of trade issues if they choose to do so. If you’ve ever applied for a federal government job, security clearance, or active military you have likely already been provided personal credit monitoring by the OPM due to a Chinese breech of government personnel records. >23 million personnel records were stolen.

I could spend all day copying and pasting links but prefer to let people do their own homework.
 
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Everything presented can be easily found using search engines referencing open source material. As the points are easily verifiable I’ll let those so interested spend some time in personal research in order to delve even further into Chinese business and trade deal transgressions, internet server breeches, IP theft, and balance of trade issues if they choose to do so. If you’ve ever applied for a federal government job, security clearance, or active military you have likely already been provided personal credit monitoring by the OPM due to a Chinese breech of government personnel records. >23 million personnel records were stolen.

I could spend all day copying and pasting links but prefer to let people do their own homework.
Your response doesn't really answer the question I have put to you.
However, we do live in a free and "open sourced" society, so your arguments are free to be expressed, even if the veracity of such argument lacks the strength they should have to achieve credibility.
You have made some claims; you need to support those claims with good evidence. An absolute requirement, even for undergraduate research.
My question to you, for the same reason, therefore remains unchanged!

Happy and safe flying :) :cool:
 

PatR

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No, i don’t have to provide you, or anyone else substantive evidence as you have the ability to perform your own info searches for verification. What you really want is for someone else to expend their effort on your behalf. Essentially you are stating you are lazy and prefer someone else does all the work.

If I was presenting a thesis, term paper, or engineering white paper that would be another story, but that isn’t the case. You’re too old to be sitting in a high chair getting spoon fed.
 
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No, i don’t have to provide you, or anyone else substantive evidence as you have the ability to perform your own info searches for verification. What you really want is for someone else to expend their effort on your behalf. Essentially you are stating you are lazy and prefer someone else does all the work.

If I was presenting a thesis, term paper, or engineering white paper that would be another story, but that isn’t the case. You’re too old to be sitting in a high chair getting spoon fed.
I'm pleased to engage in an open argument at any time.
However, I believe the rules that apply on this forum are: "you play the ball, not the man".

For the record; while I am on the wrong side of 65 + a couple of years, I don't consider myself to be too old. I certainly don't spend my day in a high chair being spoon fed. I hold three post graduate qualifications, graduating from the last in 2018. Plus I also still work full time at a highly functional and senior level to support the health needs of people across the adult age spectrum.

This post is ended.

Happy and safe flying :cool: :)
 
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