Batteries...

[Kenneth Gruskin]

As a new H owner, I have read a lot comments in this forum and the instructions concerning the battery charge level when being stored.

As I understand it, the batteries are suppose to be stored at about 50% charge, not 100%. So here is my question. If I have 3 batteries and they are charged to 100% in anticipation of being used and I only use 1 or 2, how am I suppose to drain the unused one(s) down to 50%? Am I suppose to turn on the H and let it sit with the unused battery in it and let it sit until it runs down to 50%?? This would mean I have to be monitoring this process for a number of hours while it wears down the battery to 50%.

And, if the battery is used from flying and I am not going to be flying the H for a while, say a few weeks or more, as I understand it, i should not leave the battery drained so I need to charge it. . .but the charger will charge it up to 100% and then I need to discharge it down to 50%??? (See paragraph 2!)

It seems convoluted -- am I missing something here?

Lastly, can a battery be stored in the H in the storage case when it is charged at 100% (for a short period like a week until its next flight) or 50% for a longer period?

Thanks for any insight and guidance on this topic -- I don't want to damage the H, the batteries or burn down my house.

Ken

 

[Rayray]

As a new H owner, I have read a lot comments in this forum and the instructions concerning the battery charge level when being stored.

As I understand it, the batteries are suppose to be stored at about 50% charge, not 100%. So here is my question. If I have 3 batteries and they are charged to 100% in anticipation of being used and I only use 1 or 2, how am I suppose to drain the unused one(s) down to 50%? Am I suppose to turn on the H and let it sit with the unused battery in it and let it sit until it runs down to 50%?? This would mean I have to be monitoring this process for a number of hours while it wears down the battery to 50%.

And, if the battery is used from flying and I am not going to be flying the H for a while, say a few weeks or more, as I understand it, i should not leave the battery drained so I need to charge it. . .but the charger will charge it up to 100% and then I need to discharge it down to 50%??? (See paragraph 2!)

It seems convoluted -- am I missing something here?

Lastly, can a battery be stored in the H in the storage case when it is charged at 100% (for a short period like a week until its next flight) or 50% for a longer period?

Thanks for any insight and guidance on this topic -- I don't want to damage the H, the batteries or burn down my house.

Ken

Personally, and you'll get plenty of different opinions, I would put burning down the house a first priority. Seriously, don't leave a fully charged battery more than a day, or a few days. Better to store a discharged battery than one fully charged. Anywhere from 14.5 to 15.2 will do for storage. it only takes a few minutes to fly a 16.8 battery down to 15. Never leave batteries in a hot car, or in the TH.

 

[Steve Carr]

You can hook up 2 automotive headlights in series to partially discharge a battery. Just keep an eye on the battery to make sure it doesn't get hot. It shouldn't take long to get it to 15v.

 

[PatR]

Best not to store a battery inserted in the H. Whenever a battery has the contacts fully engaged there will be some drain on the battery. Removing them also prevents accidentally turning the system on when handling the H for maintenance checks.

Owners have the option of obtaining a different charger and charge adapters for battery maintenance. What's provided with the H is great for Yuneec but not so much for the owners.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[CraigCam]

A good charger and cable to manage 3 batteries is probably in your future. I rotate 3 batteries and try to get at least one flight in a day but when I'm grounded for a couple due to weather, I double check that they are up to 4.2 a cell with a balancer as they do loose voltage over time on their own. LiPo batteries are a really sketchy technology and I've almost burned down my house with a brand new battery in a charger. You don't really own your power but lease it as over time they wear out and with a 4 cell your chances of a bad cell happening increase. The biggest damage is caused by over flying the LVC in hot conditions or charging before the battery is back to room temperature. So far, my stock batteries have behaved well and are still flat and no puffy visible and I've put a
It of hours on them. Eventually I may try a 3rd party battery but with my Q500 the stock batteries have been great and it was my alleged better Venom that has puffed up. For that reason, I'm currently sticking with stock batteries.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

 

[PatR]

Lipo life cycle is often rated in number of cycles. How you treat them generally establishes how many cycles you will obtain from them. Of course quality of the cells plays an important part as well. 200 cycles is excellent, anything less suggests there's room for improvement either in cell quality or how the owner makes use of their batteries.

4.2v/cell is much too high for storage voltage. Nominal cell voltage for a Lipo is 3.7v.

I think we might all agree better chargers could be provided for consumer drones but we need to understand manufacturers have to market their wares and that a very large number of buyers don't have a clue about Lipo battery care and maintenance, causing manufacturers to design and provide a charger where the user won't become their own worst enemy and burn the house or car down. Many posts about batteries and their care in numerous multirotor forums provide ample evidence of users not possessing any knowledge relative to the batteries they are using.

A quick Google search would provide them with an abundance of websites that specialize in batteries, and instructions on how to use and care for them. For many that would provide a one stop location to obtain a tremendous amount of battery and charger knowledge without waiting for multiple replies that are often contradictory.

 

[Kenneth Gruskin]

Thanks for the experience share. As read the comments and suggestions, it is still seems more like art than science.

So, the major takeaways are--remove battery from H when not being flown and reduce battery level to 14.2 or so to store them; be careful if charging them when they are hot from being outside our used; they only have so many charging charging cycles before they fail.

As CraigCam mentions he "almost burned down" is house when charging a battery it begs the question: do you all place a battery in a charge a leave it unsupervised to charge for the 5 hours (like overnight) or stay by it incase something goes wrong??

Is there a charger that is recommended to replace the unit that comes with the H that will better manage these issues and charge it (or reduce it) to 50% automatically as needed for storage?

Thanks again all,

Ken

 

[Falcon Arial]

H

 

[Falcon Arial]

Hello not an answer to your question but a question of my own. I try to take care of my batteries not only so I don't burn things up but hate the thought of ruining batteries worth over $200 each. Trying to start a business were may need to be available on short notice. So here I sit with no charged batteries and need to tell them no problem I can be there in 5 or 6 hours. So is there a quick charger available that anyone has tried

 

[PatR]

To answer a few questions in earlier posts;

There is no such thing as a "quick charge" for a lipo battery. Google lipo battery charging and read what has been meticulously prepared by battery companies, or search for more info here. They require time.

Storage voltage should be ~14.8v to 15.2v for an H battery. Close to the nominal voltage for the individual cells and pack cell count.

Never leave charging lipo batteries unattended unless you are charging them outside on bare dirt and the electrical source is isolated from your home. You can't put out a fire if you aren't there if and when it occurs. You probably won't hear a fire erupt if you are sound asleep. If you're lucky a smoke alarm may wake you up in time to exit the house and watch it burn down.

Do not "over night" charge a lipo battery. Many have accidentally done it and gotten away with it but you could be the unlucky one. We never know when the bad stuff is going to happen.

A good charger requires only an hour or so to charge at a 1C rate. Buy one along with a couple of charge adapters. A pro needs to accept they need to do more than the minimum to get the job done. I have 7 batteries and obtain more when job conditions require as part of the cost of doing business. Those expenses also include obtaining more charging systems if the workload demands it. Batteries are stored at 15.2v and charged either the day before or on the day they will be needed. It takes ~3 hours to charge them all.

Take a charger and extension cord with you to the job. At minimum take the auto adapter and charger to charge a battery while enroute to the work site. They are very slow but something is better than nothing. Make charging accessories part of your "kit" if you are doing this stuff professionally. Yes, it's expensive but it's an investment in assuring your income. They will last much longer than your aircraft.

Start shopping for a cheaper battery supplier. $200.00/battery is about $70.00 higher per battery than the highest I've seen in the U.S. OTOH, if you're Australian write a letter to your gov about your currency and exchange rates. You folks get hosed.

There are few questions left to be researched and answered about lipo batteries. What they are and require has been well documented, understood, and accepted for quite a long time. They have been in use with RC, computers, cameras, and phones for almost 20 years and the information regarding their use and care is plastered in a great many internet and print publications. New users and those that have not performed their "due diligence" are really the only sources of confusion where lipo's are concerned. They need to go to official sources of battery information (battery manufacturers/distributors/charger manufacturers/science and tech documents) and perform a little in depth reading, not just hope the information will come to them. Google is an extremely effective tool for this kind of research.

 

[CraigCam]

Thanks for the experience share. As read the comments and suggestions, it is still seems more like art than science.

So, the major takeaways are--remove battery from H when not being flown and reduce battery level to 14.2 or so to store them; be careful if charging them when they are hot from being outside our used; they only have so many charging charging cycles before they fail.

As CraigCam mentions he "almost burned down" is house when charging a battery it begs the question: do you all place a battery in a charge a leave it unsupervised to charge for the 5 hours (like overnight) or stay by it incase something goes wrong??

Is there a charger that is recommended to replace the unit that comes with the H that will better manage these issues and charge it (or reduce it) to 50% automatically as needed for storage?

Thanks again all,

Ken

My fire was from a new blade 350 battery on a decent charger. I set it up in my garage and went to dinner. It was New Year's Eve. Luckily we decided against a movie after and drove home to find smoke pouring out of the garage as we opened the door. I knew immediately that it was the battery. Fortunately, I was set up on a metal crate and it was just starting to melt a nearby plastic bucket when I hit it with a good fire extinguisher.

Lesson learned and I went out and got or made metal storage boxes and now planning charging and storage time is part of my daily routine depending on what I fly. Having reliable power is everything with these beasts so being a lipo slave comes with the job. The stock Yuneec batteries for both my H and 500 always charge well and have been holding balance and capacitance over many hours and cycles of charge and discharge.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

 

[BobW55]

My only 2 cents here is NEVER store a battery in the aircraft. I do not care if it is 100% charged, discharged, or at storage voltage. It is not worth the risk that there is some trickle voltage powering the aircraft and sitting like that could totally discharge your battery. (battery is now dead)
just not worth the risk.

 

[Chukky]

As a new H owner, I have read a lot comments in this forum and the instructions concerning the battery charge level when being stored.

As I understand it, the batteries are suppose to be stored at about 50% charge, not 100%. So here is my question. If I have 3 batteries and they are charged to 100% in anticipation of being used and I only use 1 or 2, how am I suppose to drain the unused one(s) down to 50%? Am I suppose to turn on the H and let it sit with the unused battery in it and let it sit until it runs down to 50%?? This would mean I have to be monitoring this process for a number of hours while it wears down the battery to 50%.

And, if the battery is used from flying and I am not going to be flying the H for a while, say a few weeks or more, as I understand it, i should not leave the battery drained so I need to charge it. . .but the charger will charge it up to 100% and then I need to discharge it down to 50%??? (See paragraph 2!)

It seems convoluted -- am I missing something here?

Lastly, can a battery be stored in the H in the storage case when it is charged at 100% (for a short period like a week until its next flight) or 50% for a longer period?

Thanks for any insight and guidance on this topic -- I don't want to damage the H, the batteries or burn down my house.

Ken

Hey Ken everyone has their own opinions, I personally keep all my batteries fully charged in a small wine fridge at 10 degrees C, I've had batteries for 18 months and they hold their voltage and flying time.

 

[Falcon Arial]

Hey Ken everyone has their own opinions, I personally keep all my batteries fully charged in a small wine fridge at 10 degrees C, I've had batteries for 18 months and they hold their voltage and flying time.

I like the sound of trying the fridge. You could respond to customers in such a short time instead of telling them sorry but I need 3 to 4 hours to charge batteries. Just makes you look more professional.

 

[Kenneth Gruskin]

Hey Ken everyone has their own opinions, I personally keep all my batteries fully charged in a small wine fridge at 10 degrees C, I've had batteries for 18 months and they hold their voltage and flying time.

Chukky,

This is an interesting approach.

Does storing them in a cool environment reduce/minimize the chance of them failing or bursting into flames when stored at 100% charge?

Is 10 degrees C the critical minimum (or maximum) temp to store them or could I place them in a regular refrigerator--I assume they need to be kept in some kind of air tight container so they do not get subjected to moisture?

 

[PatR]

The people that make batteries do not support storing them in a charged state. Perhaps there are people that know more about these batteries than the people that design and manufacture them. If there are, find the white papers they have prepared that supports their positions and review them carefully. Until then, those that store charged lipoly batteries for extended periods are making personal decisions using internet hearsay and trusting to luck. Perhaps you'll have better luck than others have had for the last decade+ lipos have been in use. FYI, lipos don't like cold temps. You can find recommended storage temps at manufacturer sites too.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[liqrome]

As a new H owner, I have read a lot comments in this forum and the instructions concerning the battery charge level when being stored.

As I understand it, the batteries are suppose to be stored at about 50% charge, not 100%. So here is my question. If I have 3 batteries and they are charged to 100% in anticipation of being used and I only use 1 or 2, how am I suppose to drain the unused one(s) down to 50%? Am I suppose to turn on the H and let it sit with the unused battery in it and let it sit until it runs down to 50%?? This would mean I have to be monitoring this process for a number of hours while it wears down the battery to 50%.

And, if the battery is used from flying and I am not going to be flying the H for a while, say a few weeks or more, as I understand it, i should not leave the battery drained so I need to charge it. . .but the charger will charge it up to 100% and then I need to discharge it down to 50%??? (See paragraph 2!)

It seems convoluted -- am I missing something here?

Lastly, can a battery be stored in the H in the storage case when it is charged at 100% (for a short period like a week until its next flight) or 50% for a longer period?

Thanks for any insight and guidance on this topic -- I don't want to damage the H, the batteries or burn down my

As a new H owner, I have read a lot comments in this forum and the instructions concerning the battery charge level when being stored.

As I understand it, the batteries are suppose to be stored at about 50% charge, not 100%. So here is my question. If I have 3 batteries and they are charged to 100% in anticipation of being used and I only use 1 or 2, how am I suppose to drain the unused one(s) down to 50%? Am I suppose to turn on the H and let it sit with the unused battery in it and let it sit until it runs down to 50%?? This would mean I have to be monitoring this process for a number of hours while it wears down the battery to 50%.

And, if the battery is used from flying and I am not going to be flying the H for a while, say a few weeks or more, as I understand it, i should not leave the battery drained so I need to charge it. . .but the charger will charge it up to 100% and then I need to discharge it down to 50%??? (See paragraph 2!)

It seems convoluted -- am I missing something here?

Lastly, can a battery be stored in the H in the storage case when it is charged at 100% (for a short period like a week until its next flight) or 50% for a longer period?

Thanks for any insight and guidance on this topic -- I don't want to damage the H, the batteries or burn down my house.

Ken

I am in the same boat too now. I had two batteries charged full yesterday - began to fly for a couple of minutes but the wind picked up - so I grounded it. It's cold where I am, hence why I didn't continue - aside from the wind. Also this week the weather is between -19 > -25 deg C with windchills on top - I am not going back out with it this week. ****.. might not be out with it until spring.

Was wondering if anyone tried running down the battery with it indoors with just turning on the motors? I'm guessing that may also take awhile.. I'm definitely not going to fly it/hover it my house - don't want to risk a crash - I don't have the real sense module.

 

[Rayray]

Was wondering if anyone tried running down the battery with it indoors with just turning on the motors?

I believe someone said there's a chance of damaging the motors like that. The cold outside should not be a problem except for you. Wind less than 20 MPH should be OK. Most 3rd party chargers will also take them down to storage voltage. If you can fly them to low 15"s, that's probably OK.
Watch out for Polar Bears.

 

[PatR]

I am in the same boat too now. I had two batteries charged full yesterday - began to fly for a couple of minutes but the wind picked up - so I grounded it. It's cold where I am, hence why I didn't continue - aside from the wind. Also this week the weather is between -19 > -25 deg C with windchills on top - I am not going back out with it this week. ****.. might not be out with it until spring.

Was wondering if anyone tried running down the battery with it indoors with just turning on the motors? I'm guessing that may also take awhile.. I'm definitely not going to fly it/hover it my house - don't want to risk a crash - I don't have the real sense module.

Fill two to four of socks with sand and lay them over the landing gear. Make sure the area is clear and run the motors at half throttle (between idle and full) to discharge the battery. It will not hurt a thing. Stop the discharge at 15v under the motor load. The unloaded voltage will be close to 15.3v, which is close enough.

 

[BlackHawk]

Fill two to four of socks with sand and lay them over the landing gear. Make sure the area is clear and run the motors at half throttle (between idle and full) to discharge the battery. It will not hurt a thing. Stop the discharge at 15v under the motor load. The unloaded voltage will be close to 15.3v, which is close enough.

Or run it without the props, no sand bags required.