CCC...What is the point?

[Skeets]

This is not a newby type question (although I am a newby with the Typhoon). I think one of the coolest features of a drone of this type is the ability of autonomous flight; to set up way points on your ground station/pc/tablet and let the drone do its thing. However, with the stock Typhoon, you have to actually fly the route to set up your waypoints. Doesn't that sorta defeat the whole purpose? Rhetorically speaking, if I can fly to these points manually, why would I need to set up waypoints?
Yes, I am aware of and use UAV Toolbox, and I plan to purchase it after my 14 day trial period (Thanks, Tuna!). As well as the other few waypoint creators out there. However, the fact that this kind of thing isn't stock with the Typhoon would probably be a deal breaker for me if UAV Toolbox, etc., were not available. I am of the understanding that Yuneec does not provide it is because too many people were setting up routes and crashing into things that they did not realize would be in the way of the drone during the mission. I do not know if that is true or not, but I am sorry to say if people are not cognizant of the potential obstacles in their route, perhaps they should be pursuing other hobbies?
Wouldn't a simple solution is to make Obstacle Avoidance available on CCC missions?

 

[Eagle's Eye Video]

However, with the stock Typhoon, you have to actually fly the route to set up your waypoints. Doesn't that sorta defeat the whole purpose? Rhetorically speaking, if I can fly to these points manually, why would I need to set up waypoints?

The routes when run have a variance of as much as 30' from the programmed route, which could potentially explain
running into an obstacle. This simply has to be accounted for when programming the route.

Using the Typhoon as a camera rig, the primary advantage is being able to use the right stick to control camera movement... this plus having the physical flying run autonomously allows the pilot to concentrate on the mechanics of operating the camera to get what you want visually, much more effectively. Second only to running team.

 

[Rayray]

Yes, those are valid observations. I suppose if one is planning a photo session, and has no one to help control the camera while he controls the flight, setting the waypoints ahead of time, by flying, will free him to shoot video. I fly a lot, but have little use for that feature personally right now. Of course entering in a number of GPS co-ordinates is tedious. Anyone using the feature needs to have adequate height set.

 

[Skeets]

The routes when run have a variance of as much as 30' from the programmed route, which could potentially explain
running into an obstacle. This simply has to be accounted for when programming the route.

If that's true, wouldn't the potential of running into an obstacle be present regardless of how you set up your waypoints, whether it be as the Typhoon is intended or by using UAV Toolbox, etc.? Yes, you do see where the H is going while you are recording stock CCC waypoints, but if the possible 30' variance exists, then it still exists, no?

 

[Eagle's Eye Video]

The variance will exist either way... if I was to plan a route I would want at least 50' clearance
in all directions including height. I also plan to from now on, to do an initial run without the camera.
That way, only concerning myself with how the route is going. Only after a successful route, would
I then add the layer of what I visually want to capture.

This is all based on what I have seen from other people's experiences of how they use CCC and
Tuna's app. Myself, I'll have about a 3 week hiatus with my bird being repaired, before I'll continue
my learning of CCC and UAV Toolbox.

As far as features for CCC mode, based on my recent crash, I would really like the Aux button be
enabled to act as a "cancel route" switch, if things go south.

 

[Steve Carr]

It is my understanding that most people who use waypoints with DJI products also use a third party app. I don't see how UAVtoolbox is any different. The accuracy of the waypoints should be fairly good provided the GPS signals are good. The altitude is much less accurate and I think that is where the 30' safety zone is advisable. The altitude is derived from a barometric altimeter and is never exactly correct on any copter.

 

[PatR]

The best method designed so far for this type if flight/camera/mission planning is calked "Spline" and used in Pixhawk type flight controllers. Crazy good. The flight plan is set up on the ground using the ground station's flight planning software. Yuneec's CCC works well but is a bit of a pain because you have to fly it once manually before executing an autonomous flight. The software does an excellent job of putting the camera on the previously established targets. DJI's version of this type of flight mode has been proven to fly the route well but blow it with putting the camera on target.

The purpose of these modes is to obtain a smooth and flowing video depicting specific targets that would be difficult to impossible to accomplish by a single operator that was both flying the aircraft and operating the camera. It also allows repeatability in performing re-shoots.

 

[Skeets]

The best method designed so far for this type if flight/camera/mission planning is calked "Spline" and used in Pixhawk type flight controllers. .

Yup! I have an Ardupilot in one of my other drones and Mission Planner does a lot of amazing things. You can even download the "Tower" app on your phone and plan missions and upload them to the drone via telemetry. The entire drone kit less radio and telemetry kit cost me $120, which includes frame, motors, ESCs, flight controller, GPS Module, etc. Frankly, my $120 drone does so much more than my $1500 H. It has waypoints, spline, circles, take-off, land, even has a leash mode which is similar to follow me/watch me, but it has many other choices. If Yuneec put that kind of programming on the H, the H would be near perfect, I think.

 

[PatR]

Agreed. That is the majority Yuneec would need to do to capture a much larger percentage of the drone market. If the flight controller provided the versatility necessary for planning and setting up numerous mission types the consumers could be left to design their own missions and leave Yuneec free to concentrate on expanding their payload selections. Imagine being able to sit at your laptop and plan a mapping, agricultural health, line or tower inspection, or video flight setting up way points, way point altitudes, speeds, camera angles, frame over laps, timed shutter triggers, system failure safety profiles, and then upload everything to the aircraft for fly without further operator input aside from monitoring the mission. At the moment Yuneec is limited mostly by their own imagination, and perhaps some financial resources, but to get ahead you have to think far ahead. The X2 and X3 flight controllers are total monsters in this regard and dwarf pretty much everything else with their capabilities. The prices are not all that high. If all Yuneec desires to do is provide a platform for basic video I suppose they are already there but their market share is not enough to be a sustainable program, and their excellent customer service rides pretty hard on the bottom line.

 

[Tuna]

It constantly surprises me the different uses people find for autonomous flights. Quite often you do want to fly a route to scout out positions and camera angles - and the CCC feature was designed mainly as a camera tool so you could grab shots that would normally require two operators. On the other hand, pre-planned routes suit other operators much better, particularly survey work. The support for this is improving, not only though my app, but also the software that Yuneec supply.

The users who really want sophisticated autonomous flight features usually spend a lot of money to get it - check out the software subscriptions and survey-specific drones to get a taste for how much it costs to get a reliable commercial drone that has good quality autonomous flight. It's true you can hack together something with Ardupilot and some of the other tools, but that's really for the hardcore operator - and would leave a lot of casual owners dangerously out of their depth.

The H was released as a general purpose 'pro-sumer' drone, and I think the tools reflect that. It has Journey, Orbit, CCC, POI, Follow me and Watch me - which is a good tool kit for getting it to do some interesting stuff. Your $120 drone doesn't include a high quality 360 degree gimbal, 4K camera, the tablet to control it or any of the radio gear, which means you're really just comparing a bunch of motors to a fully working aerial camera rig.

They should be releasing the SDK fairly soon which could open up a lot of possibilities. I try to add features to my app if enough people request them, but you'd be surprised how few people ask for anything so complicated. I'm aiming to improve support for mapping, but not that many people ask me for other autonomous flight tools beyond what UAV Toolbox already provides.

 

[Skeets]

Your $120 drone doesn't include a high quality 360 degree gimbal, 4K camera, the tablet to control it or any of the radio gear, which means you're really just comparing a bunch of motors to a fully working aerial camera rig.

Well, yes and no. As someone who already owns a GoPro and a Nikon KeyMission 360 camera, radio gear and the tablet (I use an old smartphone, but you really don't even need that as you can setup your missions on your PC and transfer them to the drone via USB) the only thing that is missing is a gimbal and I have a fully working aerial camera rig and not just a bunch of motors. For someone who doesnt already have the necessary equipment to turn that $120 drone into that fully working rig, I do believe that the H is an outstanding package at a great price considering what you get

 

[PatR]

The flight controller is the heart of every "drone" and either limits or accentuates what a drone can accomplish with any given payload. A $200.00-$300.00 flight controller that has the ability to integrate code from various cloud based service providers opens a great many doors for the educated user. APM based FC's allow that functionality. Having it the limits are what a user us willing to spend on payloads, software, and lift capability.

The H suits a casual user quite well but with minor changes could do so much more. We'll have to wait and see what they did with the 520 to establish what their corporate plan envisions.

 

[mwfoshee]

@Tuna

It constantly surprises me the different uses people find for autonomous flights. Quite often you do want to fly a route to scout out positions and camera angles - and the CCC feature was designed mainly as a camera tool so you could grab shots that would normally require two operators. On the other hand, pre-planned routes suit other operators much better, particularly survey work. The support for this is improving, not only though my app, but also the software that Yuneec supply.

The users who really want sophisticated autonomous flight features usually spend a lot of money to get it - check out the software subscriptions and survey-specific drones to get a taste for how much it costs to get a reliable commercial drone that has good quality autonomous flight. It's true you can hack together something with Ardupilot and some of the other tools, but that's really for the hardcore operator - and would leave a lot of casual owners dangerously out of their depth.

The H was released as a general purpose 'pro-sumer' drone, and I think the tools reflect that. It has Journey, Orbit, CCC, POI, Follow me and Watch me - which is a good tool kit for getting it to do some interesting stuff. Your $120 drone doesn't include a high quality 360 degree gimbal, 4K camera, the tablet to control it or any of the radio gear, which means you're really just comparing a bunch of motors to a fully working aerial camera rig.

They should be releasing the SDK fairly soon which could open up a lot of possibilities. I try to add features to my app if enough people request them, but you'd be surprised how few people ask for anything so complicated. I'm aiming to improve support for mapping, but not that many people ask me for other autonomous flight tools beyond what UAV Toolbox already provides.

"The users who really want sophisticated autonomous flight features usually spend a lot of money to get it"

I am such a user, lol. you sir are correct. I recently priced (just for kicks) a new TopCon, Falcon 8 system. The "system" was priced verbally from TopCon for around 50k, I did see the same unit online branded as intel Falcon 8 for a listed price at 35k. This makes the H HIGHLY attractive to me. My main issue has been the lack of support when trying to use some of the online options for image processing. Maps Made Easy for example has a great service in which I pay only for the processing I need, per job. Like I said, the rub comes when the "Job" won't process because of errors. By far the most common "fix" given me by the customer service dept. at Maps Made Easy (and others)...............I should buy a DJI product! That's all the help I'm given. So I'm hoping

"They should be releasing the SDK fairly soon which could open up a lot of possibilities."

and maybe this will make a difference.

From what I can figure, the EXIF generated is not the same as what DJI and other products are using. For instance, when I viewed the GPS altitude data from my last job in most file/image viewers, the altitude shows correctly as 38 meters; However, when I view the same image in a more sophisticated program "GEOSetter" for example, the same 38 meters is shown yet another field not normally seen in regular image viewers called GPS Altitude Ref has a value "Below Sea Level":



When I go a little further to actually edit the EXIF data the value for GPS Altitude is actually negative:



I've pointed this out in another thread and to Yuneec CS. I was told this issue was given directly to the person who works on this type of error and a case number, after two or three weeks I received an email stating something like "this issue has been resolved, thank you for using Yuneec Customer Service" ......... I was hoping that meant that the next firmware update would fix this. that was in November 2016. The images above were from last week. My Firmware is up to date.

I'm now working on my own Hex using Emlid's reach GPS and A Navio@ with Rasberry Pi as a flight controller. Still praying Yuneec will address this though, I do still love my H.

@Tuna will opening up or releasing the SDK allow smart fellows such as your self to address EXIF/Meta data errors in the images? Thanks

 

[Typhoon Charlie]

mwfoshee
Same problem here. I use Microsoft ICE to render maps and works quire well. Have not had any luck with on line processors using the CGO 3+.

 

[mwfoshee]

@Typhoon Charlie, all I've used ICE for is 360° PANO's - (facebook style) Does it work for flat stitching as well?

 

[Typhoon Charlie]

Here is a sample I did

59 Acres Map

 

[mwfoshee]

Sweet, I usually need the Digital Elevation Model generated by Maps Mad Easy to generate topos, but this will be perfect for Survey only Maps. Thanks

 

[Michael Brown]

I don't use CCC often but there have been times, as an example, I wanted the H to fly straight down the middle of a street. Flew it to my first point and marked it. Raised it high above any obstacles and flew it to my second point way down the street. Lowered it to where it should end and locked in my second point. It flew in a perfectly straight line from A to B. Try doing that manually.....turned out great. 90% of the time I fly manually.

 

[Crazy Crow]

I love the CCC feature even though it did cost me my typhoon H today.

It gives me the ability to get those awesome panning shots that make a scene come to life.
This is, to my knowledge, the only thing that this feature was intended for.

Today I plotted a course over a small shallow lake in a wooded area where my kids were paddling around in a small inflatable boat. I set up 5 waypoints flying the H around the lake. Some high and some low waypoints ending with a low (about 15 meters above water level).
I started the route taking some great shots going round the mission and everything seemed fine. Untill the last waypoint where it wouldn't stop at the lowest point but just kept going. I pushed the stop button and hit full throttle but it was too late. A big splash and it was under.
I quickly jumped in and pulled it out from approximatly 1 meter deep water. It was still on, beeping and flashing red.
The camera started initialising and the gimbal set itself level. I quickly pulled out the battery but 1 motor started to smoke already. After the power was off it stopped.

Back home I took the whole H apart and found that was little to no water left in the drone. I put it in the sun and dried everything with a hairdryer until there was no visible moisture left. An extra hour in the baking sun should do the trick.

Reconnected all plugs and put in the battery. It booted up but failed to initialise.
Connected it to GUI and that showed an ESC failure.
It seems that is the only problem. Everything else works so I guess I'm lucky it struck water. Land would have been worse.

 

[Eagle's Eye Video]

Sorry you had that crash... my H also recently crashed attempting my 1st CCC route
(though for an entirely different reason).

Because of the variance both in determining altitude on the H and the exact final CCC route
(as opposed to what you programmed). I would never set the minimum height for a waypoint
below 40'...

Also I would do an initial run without the camera, to confirm the route... the camera is the single
most expensive component on the H, and since it's not needed to fly a CCC route... why risk
damage before confirmation the the route will complete as expected. One of the advantages
of CCC is the ability to repeat the route, on a subsequent run with the camera.