Gatwick flights suspended after reports of drones over runway

[NorWiscPilot]

I will try to stay on topic by discussing the actual article.

From the airport personnel to the prime minister; from the general public to the British Airline Pilots Association... references are being made to stricter laws already put in place, tighter restrictions are needed, etc. The Pilots Association calling for a wider no fly zone mandate.

What seems to be missing from the conversation here is one glaring observation: this incident is being considered "a deliberate act to shut down airport operations..."

If this is true, no amount of regulations, restrictions, certifications, banning the use of, et al is going to make any difference to anyone with the resources to carry out something like this. If someone or some "group" is determined to carry out acts like that being portrayed in the article, they are going to do it.

Remind anyone of any other similar topics - something happens and everyone demands tighter controls? The old adage "laws are for law abiding citizens" applies to unmanned aerial operations as well. Outlaws don't care about laws.

My hope, aside from the truth coming out about the Gatwick incident, is that civil discussions will continue, including how law abiding citizens (pilots) are already keeping their airspace safe. It is the ones who feel the laws do not apply to them that will continue to endanger the safe and cooperative use of the skies.

Best wishes to all affected by the situation being discussed. Hopefully a swift resolution will be forthcoming if not already done so.

Jeff

 

[Ty Pilot]

Remind anyone of any other similar topics - something happens and everyone demands tighter controls? The old adage "laws are for law abiding citizens" applies to unmanned aerial operations as well. Outlaws don't care about laws.


Jeff

Yes, I was thinking exactly the same thing before I read your post. It's sad really that people no longer think in the ways we used to. Logic, is increasingly no longer part of the equation. Yet there are still examples in our society where this 'group think' doesn't happen. As an example, Cars. Cars kill more humans than just about anything man made but some how the focus for that segment of dangerous things has been and remains; the driver. As a community, we need to figure out how to do this before we are erased.

 

[AeroJ]

Well here's some video at long last...
'First footage of drone evading police helicopters' at Gatwick Airport | Metro News

 

[Jagerbomb52]

Yup looks pretty real to me.

 

[Phaedrus]

Yep.

 

[Chefinthesky]

It's clearly a dark gray or black quad of some sort, and given the approximate size at the distance it was filmed from, I doubt it was a Mantis, etc. and the pilot was no doubt flying way out of LOS. I think the lighting configuration from the grainy pic looks odd to say the least so it could be a homemade drone from a kit, many of them use black carbon fiber frames, etc. Shame one or two people can cause so much chaos. Being stuck in an airport during the holidays is just the worst, and it will only tangle up service for days. If the public ever finds out who this poor soul is... I think there should be a reward out for the pilot.

 

[thetrecker]

Well here's some video at long last...
'First footage of drone evading police helicopters' at Gatwick Airport | Metro News

been following this all day ( live ) and find it unbelievable that this is all the footage there is.
This started at 9:00 ish yesterday evening (11 hrs so far ) with all the people travelling holidays etc has nobody got a decent camera there anywhere to get a better pic
also saying this is not a terrorist attack well it might as well be as its definitely orchestrated to cause havoc during Christmas travel time

 

[Ren57]

It's clearly a dark gray or black quad of some sort, and given the approximate size at the distance it was filmed from, I doubt it was a Mantis, etc. and the pilot was no doubt flying way out of LOS. I think the lighting configuration from the grainy pic looks odd to say the least so it could be a homemade drone from a kit, many of them use black carbon fiber frames, etc. Shame one or two people can cause so much chaos. Being stuck in an airport during the holidays is just the worst, and it will only tangle up service for days. If the public ever finds out who this poor soul is... I think there should be a reward out for the pilot.

I've just watched the BBC 6pm news, then the Channel 4 - 7pm new. It was the lead story on both channels. Loads of comment obviously and a lot of very angry passengers. It was reiterated in both news items that it WAS an industrial size drone, not the blurry picture we've got on here. No pictures of the drone were shown on either of the 2 channels main news slot. I find that hard to believe given the amount of airtime this story is getting. Yes, we can expect a big backlash because of this. I won't be flying again until this has well and truly died down....

 

[Chefinthesky]

I've just watched the BBC 6pm news, then the Channel 4 - 7pm new. It was the lead story on both channels. Loads of comment obviously and a lot of very angry passengers. It was reiterated in both news items that it WAS an industrial size drone, not the blurry picture we've got on here. No pictures of the drone were shown on either of the 2 channels main news slot. I find that hard to believe given the amount of airtime this story is getting. Yes, we can expect a big backlash because of this. I won't be flying again until this has well and truly died down....

Ren you make a very good point that I didn't even think of - I wouldn't want to be seen flying a drone for any reason there. Such a shame - so many beautiful places in London/England etc. for drone videography.

 

[thetrecker]

tomany post to quote but somebody said it was amazon delivery think your wrong maybe vodafone
( not far from me yesterday ) Vodafone conducts UK’s first 4G drone delivery think they had a flyaway after doing this

 

[Ren57]

been following this all day ( live ) and find it unbelievable that this is all the footage there is.
This started at 9:00 ish yesterday evening (11 hrs so far ) with all the people travelling holidays etc has nobody got a decent camera there anywhere to get a better pic
also saying this is not a terrorist attack well it might as well be as its definitely orchestrated to cause havoc during Christmas travel time

Well, the drone in that video is clearly or should I say blurry, a one of the DJI Phantom range. I didn't see any video of the police helicopter it was supposed to be evading though. It also said in the article below the video, that the video was BELIEVED to be of the drone being flown over Gatwick. Whatever, it wasn't an industrial sized drone....

 

[AeroJ]

I won't be flying again until this has well and truly died down....

Easy there dude - you are not doing anything wrong ! It would be wrong to be frightened out of the sky by this ! We don't stop driving just because other people have crashed cars, do we ? Weather-permitting I am going out tomorrow for a nice, safe, responsible flight regardless, and it'll be interesting to see if I get any comments or hostility !

I just hope the repercussions from this episode will result in better anti-drone tech at airports, and not to punishing us all with EVEN MORE ridiculously restrictive rules that apply everywhere. Some bl**dy hope !!

 

[Ren57]

I will try to stay on topic by discussing the actual article.

From the airport personnel to the prime minister; from the general public to the British Airline Pilots Association... references are being made to stricter laws already put in place, tighter restrictions are needed, etc. The Pilots Association calling for a wider no fly zone mandate.

I have a Q500, A Typhoon H and a DJI Mavic Pro. I live 3 miles (line of sight) from Manchester International airport. None of my drones will even start at my house because of the no fly zone software. So, like you say, you can bring in all the rules and restrictions you like, they will only affect the already law abiding drone pilots. Those who want to do this sort of thing are not bothered about the law, regulations or the dangers. It's pretty easy for anyone who wants to to build their own drone. The technology is already out there and there are hundreds of how to video's on how to do it. People that do this sort of thing need catching and suffer a nice long rest in one of her majesty's special hotels...... New laws and regulations will do nothing....

 

[Ren57]

Easy there dude - you are not doing anything wrong ! It would be wrong to be frightened out of the sky by this ! We don't stop driving just because other people have crashed cars, do we ? Weather-permitting I am going out tomorrow for a nice, safe, responsible flight regardless, and it'll be interesting to see if I get any comments or hostility !

I just hope the repercussions from this episode will result in better anti-drone tech at airports, and not to punishing us all with EVEN MORE ridiculously restrictive rules that apply everywhere. Some bl**dy hope !!

I'd be interested to hear if you get any comments as well. I'll be in Wales Christmas day, the weather looks like it'll be alright. If it is I'll be flying.......!

 

[PatR]

I hope I can get people to step back and think about this from a perspective where they are not offended by an "apparent" act of extreme irresponsibility. The critical part of this is to get people to consider alternative planning and execution. If you are one pushing for mandatory geo fencing, this is how you achieve it. The same applies for mandatory remote aircraft ID broadcasting. If you are one that needs civilian drones restricted to flight in only severely limited areas, you’ll get all the traction you can use this way.

The best way to shape public opinion is by generating a public outrage. The best way to generate public outrage is to seriously inconvenience the public while threatening their safety. As we've seen so many times in the past and present the press is frequently used to inflame public opinion. Not just with drones but with public safety in general. The more angry and concerned the public becomes the easier it becomes to enact legislation that further restricts the general public in the name of public safety. In fact, done properly, acts and press releases can be generated that cause the public to insist new restrictive legislation be adopted. Such has happened in the UK, EU, and USA. If we remember back to when the press reported that a drone had been landed on the White House lawn most don't recall that the person who did it was a high security clearance level government employee alleged to be under the influence of alcohol at the time of his actions. The press brushed that part of it under the rug while amplifying the potential dangers of drones in the hands of private citizens. How many of us know the press and our governments have lied to us many, may times?

After looking at the heavily cropped picture of what appears to be a Mavic with no background other than sky there is nothing present to suggest a time, date, or location for reference. It's just a really bad picture of a drone in flight. The posted video also offers little or nothing to suggest a drone was interrupting airport operations. As we know that drones are being used in Germany for airplane inspections and at several airports in the U.S. and elsewhere for airport infrastructure inspections, with some other airports using drones for bird dispersal, we don't have anything to suggest the drone in the video was being used in an illegal or inappropriate manner. We should recognize that all military and law enforcement videos overlay a tremendous amount of reference data on the imagery they generate. Time, date, GPS location are all standard while imagery shot from aerial platforms overlay headings and altitudes. As these drones were alleged to be pursued by helicopters, where's the video that was most certainly shot while the pursuit was in progress? Where's the record of the radar tracks for the chase aircraft? Why were the people manning the control tower, a building that provides a 360* view of airport operations, unable to visually follow the alleged drones? I can assure you they have very powerful binoculars for use in viewing airport operations and searching for "no radio" aircraft approaching the airport. As manned helicopters are quite fast, extremely maneuverable, can remain airborne for long periods of time, and carry both a pilot and one or more observers, how could a drone possibly evade them? Where are the videos that would most certainly have been shot from these helicopters? A UK police helicopter had no problem following a Phantom that had been "interfering" with a police action back to it's launch point and operator so why were they not able to follow the offending drones in this event? How many holes do we need in the bottom of a bucket before it won't hold water?

Until such time as irrefutable evidence of this drone incursion is presented I just can't put any stock in this reported act actually happening. It stinks of a government wanting something and using every means at their disposal to obtain it. The only things that are at this time factual is that an airport was shut down and a great many people were seriously inconvenienced and their travel plans disrupted at a time when everyone is trying to join family and friends for the biggest holiday of the year.

Just think about it and calmly and logically for a few minutes, leaving anger and outrage out of the process. Where is the "provable" evidence? How difficult is it to get people to believe something if that something has or will have a negative effect on them? How hard is it to get people to beg for protection when they are led to believe they are in danger?

 

[Jagerbomb52]

 

[PatR]

Another person that instantly buys into a story and launches a video using the media as a fact based source.

According to the media the drone comes when authorities leave and leaves when authorities arrive. Since when can a 50mph-60mph “industrial drone” outrun a 160 knot helicopter? How can a 50-60 mph drone manage to evade a 70-100 power zoom lens mounted on a military grade gimbal?

The latest story about this I read tonight closed with a push from authorities for mandatory geo fencing. I hate to sound like a conspiracy theorist but one company has been lobbying governments to adopt their geo fence software for the last couple years. That effort failed in the U.S. but was accepted and legislated into law by the E.U. The U. K. had, until now, remained on the fence. On the U.S. side the only reason it didn’t fly is because the U.S. wants to use home grown solutions with home based revenue streams, not Chinese.

 

[PatR]

And this little jewel from sUAS News pops up in my inbox a few hours ago:
DJI Offers AeroScope Assistance To Gatwick Airport Incident Investigators - sUAS News - The Business of Drones

 

[Mrgs1]

Police haven't found anyone yet, very fishy. I think this all along was done to discredit drones. I've read that America airports have countermeasures, how successful are they?

 

[Jagerbomb52]

A few reasons why cops haven't immediately shot down London Gatwick airport drone menace