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Special notice from DJI. Matrice inflight power loss.

I don't share the minimalist view regarding the battery issue. One to three failures??? Um. I seriously question that assumption. I also don't see a migration to smart batteries. Adding layers of complexity often results in less reliability. My car has no smart battery and I'm good with that.

Beyond the few indicated in the findings that the report & notices were generated and agreeing that an attempt to conceal by company or Govt is possible; wouldn't approach the numbers if any substantial percentage were effected. You'd have forums, UAV business reporting loss or incidents, and you'd have an eager / ambitious media jumping on any similar accident or crash.

Has any additional incidents been in the news or forums? I haven't seen anything! Even if 80-90% were successfully "covered up", you'd have more incidents fall prey to media... where are they? This isn't a platform that has low volume sales, it's a pretty high distribution platform, and the I2 is substantially higher distribution running the same TB50's. Where's all the I2's going down, they're used in more environments around public. If these Drones were limited distributed speciality crafts like the Wind series, not sold to consumer but speciality shops I might accept the likely hood of concealing easier but that still would't shield them from media grabbing & printing any juicy story showing the drone as bad or dangerous.

I agree company & govt's tend to attempt to cover things up, but like other "leaks" in media that hasn't been successfully managed and the media will push a story anytime. In the days of media making Drones the evil craft from above, any crash would most likely be reported and any RC enthusiast disliking DJI would publicize their local newspaper incident. This conversation has ran on a Yuneec forum and minimized by professional business on DJI related sites; incidently these professionals mostly see them as tools, many aren't brand focused and would migrate to any platform that provided similar performance & profits.

There's been more reported incidents of the I2's falling from sky or going out of control due to motor adhesion problem, more incidents of the H520 dead falling due to electronics, more unexplained fly aways of various models, etc. Where's the press and safety notices on these issues? I expected an I2 recall and a notice last year to be issued, never happened? I can easily find more internet chatter on these incidents.

This battery incident started with a Govt Unit's inventory. We're already touched on SOP and delayed procedures of Govt & Military. The Notice & associated media all reference the Police CT team, no other incidents even sited within the reports. Media Story line contains: Drone, Falling from sky, Police, Counter Terrorist TacTeam, and Fear. Some stories improperly reported that the M200 series was "grounded" which wasn't accurate but possibly better story line?

When an auto model encounters a problem that even "hints" a safety concern, even with extreme counter measures by company and various govt agencies to control the media; it's suddenly rampant throughout the media and hundreds come forth with similar stories. Same for a home appliance, firearm, or new electronic device... all get the media attention that attempts to instill fear, danger or concern. Drones are clearly a media target and this incident just didn't spread as expected.

Automotive battery: More of a friendly exchange.
I wasn't focused on the battery within an automobile, more on the "primary" power train. Within a fuel based vehicle, the battery is a side module designed to provide power to start the system and then passing electrical operations over to the electronics to run the vehicle. You're correct, not a lot of intelligence in a simple storage cell, but it still has electronics supporting it beyond the simple 14.2 volt regulator, alternators a fraction of the size and 3 times power to generate current, and it lacks the old diodes and solenoid contact disk from the older days... so it's progressing. Even the Diesel that requires no electrical current to run has encountered major advancements in both fuel management and electronics.

Electric Car: When the battery is the primary form of powertrain, the electrical battery system is very intelligent and the circuits contain multiple modules of firmware. It's a bigger scale, but the battery cells mounted on frame rails are essentially the cells within an Intelligent / Smart battery.

Myself, like others are not able to see the future so it's all estimates based on the evolution of technology. When safety or Govt Management (aka: Control) get involved the technology curve accelerates eventually results in several new mandates. Take the radio frequency spectrum as example, crystals gone and electronics advanced in rapid generations. The ability to divide the frequencies into extremely small sections wasn't even considered a short time back in history and has now become mandated and classified.

I'll wait and see, but it's pretty evident the primary power source of aerial crafts are going to be a point of concern, monitoring, logs and most likely control; that's going to require intelligent electronics. Actually, I see it going further... if RC continues to be "allowed" as sport or pleasure; I see the ability of Govt or Law Enforcement having access to control newer models will be part of the new electronics from taking control, force landing, etc.
 
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Jumping forward 2 months after the battery ordeal... in addition, after the drama surrounding the UK Gatwick Airport drone ordeal that appears fabricated after the dust settles, possibly motivated by other political factors.

Revisiting the battery ordeal; provides a little more clarity "possibly" after a single UK Police CT incident and no additional incidents verified or indicated. The battery story line was over-hyped, fear inducing and driven by all media in a similar, smaller scale manor at Gatwick Airport... was it a test run? Then suddenly even before a solution was provided, "poof" all vanished into DVR history. This all transpired as the majority of M210 & I2 units remained flying performing their daily tasks without incident.

Even the quietly announced Firmware solution has turned into a fiasco, 3 versions (correcting and adding features) with questions of what it's actually addressing: pilot behavior enforcement, weather limitation improvements, added intelligence to perform internal cell balance routine, etc. That wasn't even actually the problem identified in the original issue: Tandem batteries reporting different levels of "percentage", if became wide enough difference there was a "reported" failure. This was odd, since every test private individuals performed could not duplicate and continued experiencing the behavior designed... the M200 series will run on 1 battery after initial take-off. It can literally loose a battery (physical or logical) off the platform and will continue flying. In my opinion, part of the problem is attempting to report voltages as a percentage and having a matrix of logic based on reported percentage. Leave it as voltage. it's much more accurate and easier to program logical operations and simply provide a screen indicator for percentage, similar to a car's idiot light for User's unfamiliar with voltage.

Jumping forward...
It's New Year's Eve in New York and several other large Metropolitan Cities. The Police Units are using drones to fly above to monitor and observe the crowds and surrounding area (not directly above crowds). What platform is trusted for the project despite the battery ordeal a few months prior: the M210 RTK with tandem TB55 batteries, a Z30 Zoom & Flair R Thermo. New York is also utilizing Mavic 2 Enterprise (self heated batteries like the TB50/55) for close ground inspections. In addition, some of the M200's used for stationary monitoring will be tethered to ground source to remain in position throughout the event.

Interesting what transpires over a few months.
 
And while all this takes place few notice the correlation of governments further restricting civilian drone operators while LEA’s and other government agencies expand their use of drones for civilian surveillance.
 
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And while all this takes place few notice the correlation of governments further restricting civilian drone operators while LEA’s and other government agencies expand their use of drones for civilian surveillance.
Yepper... watch this hand of media waving while this hand performs the acts!

A good politician / agency knows how to use the media to help work their agenda.
 
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BTW, 30mph winds predicted for tonight's extravaganza in Time's Square. I have yet to see a DJI drone that deals well with high winds. As it has been said they will be tethered this might turn out to be an expensive lesson in how to handle a yo-yo.
 
BTW, 30mph winds predicted for tonight's extravaganza in Time's Square. I have yet to see a DJI drone that deals well with high winds. As it has been said they will be tethered this might turn out to be an expensive lesson in how to handle a yo-yo.

My retouch on this thread was on the possible misleading of various issues to direct drone publicity in a negative direction and the hypocrisy of suggesting a grounding to not fly then 2 months later use in large public gathering. In my opinion both the TB50/55 battery issue & the Gatwick Airport issue are essentially fabricated... time will tell.

Always enjoy a good discussion... Wind
Good point; For anything airborne in a contained area or suspended, a 30 mph Wind isn't an ideal environment... isn't the "NY Ball" tethered now a days for safety... that would be a concern having it wind sway too. No longer freely lowered by crane cable. I'd also factor in the Velocity Effect between buildings as a possible variable which will be a higher speed to be concerned.

Yep, the M200 or M210's will be tethered and hopefully those fancy Ground Station power systems are designed with optimal tension controllers. Personally I think they'd have to ground the tethered units, possibly the airborne too. The M210 RTK's won't be tethered, not much need of RTK if tethered, and if the M2Es get up out of building block it will probably be a bad thing. In my opinion, I personally find tethered drones or hovering drones being utilized in this type of huge public gathering in place of multiple cameras is motivated by other reasons: sales, push of technology, etc. If Observers needed a better angle for an particular instance, they could launch a drone for a look & return.

You are correct and it would be a concern: For a M210, 30mph is at it's specified spec limits of 12m/s Wind (26mph) but as all Dronies we have faith eh! The P4 is 10m/S, M210 12m/s and 51.4 Max Speed, M600 Hex 8m/s and since Yuneec refuses to list the wind in specs an estimate can be applied... Generally the max wind is roughly half (60-65%) Max Fwd Speed. The H520 spec 17m/s (38) and various statements (sales reps & forum chatter) have stated 17-20mph Wind, indicates a 8.9m/s, Typhoon H Plus spec 13.4m/s (30mph) Max Fwd Speed indicating 8.5m/s estimate. Although we ALL quickly disagree with these based on personal experience. Edit add-on: Yuneec lists H Plus as 30 max on one page, and 44.7 on EU page, and 41 in USA manual... so excuse the error of inaccuracy.

Ground speed is a Delta of Airspeed & Wind. Since CoD is crap for all drones, most variables can be tossed for basic estimates other than Speed & Wind, inversely the same. Since we know Airspeed is the vector difference between ground speed and wind speed... this implies as one is reaches zero the other can reach maximum. If Wind zero, GS & Airspeed near equal and basically opposite applies, as Wind speed approaches Airspeed Max the GS nears Zero. In hovering AC, if Wind higher Max Speed you can have negative... moving backwards.

Removing the electronics to counter and react to Wind and going on Max Air Speed & Wind dynamics, none of them particularly have an advantage for 30+ high winds. I don't have a H520 (yet) but in an informal Fall Wind test (est 25, with 40 gusts) to maneuver around my yard & trees with my M210, H480, Mavic, I2, I1. The Mavic couldn't perform, the H480 performed extremely well but the M210 easily exceeded to move & navigate in my opinion due to power advantage. I don't have RTK, so if the RTK assisted in GPS tonight's M210RTK's may have a fighting chance. Still, I think they'll have to ground them purely for public safety... especially in current time with all the negative drone media. In addition, I also don't think you'll be seeing the manned Heli's flying close to buildings much either... if 30 on ground, altitude is probably over 50-60.
 
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A constant speed surface wind is of little concern as the effects are predictable. Such a wind is either within tolerable levels, or not. That same wind blowing over snd between buildings of different shapes and sizes is a completely different matter, totally unpredictable in direction and velocity.
 
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Yep, that is correct but it's also correct on the limitations of the Wind resistance... it does have an effect. If max is 30 for pretty much any AC... gusts or steady, you're at the limits. Gust increase a control issue but not wind limitations. Steady wind wasn't specified, max was indicated. My reference of personal test was 25/40gust and as noted in 1st paragraph of Wind, I note Velcity Effect as well for a concern.

Happy New Year Pat, and to a new year of enjoyable discussion with a Fellow... Grumpy Ole Fart!
 
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Feliz Ano Nuevo back at ya. It appears someone in the NYPD thought things through and decided drones in rain and wind wasn’t a good idea.
 
While you may not find the rated wind for the H520 it has been tested along with an Inspire and P4.

 
While you may not find the rated wind for the H520 it has been tested along with an Inspire and P4.
Happy New Year Steve!
Yep, that's an older one that has been around with H520, Inspire 1, P4 and others are floating the cloud,... many more on H480, H520, M210, Inspire 2, M600 Hex, all displaying a Wind demo and all impressive. Many videos showing their spec'ed or suggested Wind limits exceeded and pushing their Max Flight speed spec to hold in Wind / Gusts.

I do find it odd how Wind specs are not listed within Yuneec specifications. I found several discussions, many sharing Yuneec Rep/Tech's comments, and a few clips at Events where Reps have responded to questions. All gave the same "zone" in their response which follows the design of most; approximately half Max Forward Speed. The fraction of Max Speed I would accept as the tolerance required to allow the reserve power required for navigation or to hold hover.

On spec's, I also found it surprising 3 spec's listed on Yuneec sites for the new Typhoon H Plus... it's a new craft and doesn't have multiple version releases. For the benefit of 3rd party designers or external operations needing to know design specifications, this should be one value unless documented versions.

On the matter of Wind, I focused on specs and the physical limitations. All have spec's on Max Speed, thus indirectly indicates their max wind if you apply the Delta of Airspeed & Wind... or the Relative Velocity. If the craft has a 40mph Max Speed, the max wind is 40 or below.... Airspeed 40, Wind 0, thus Airspeed 0, Wind 40, and Airspeed 60, Tail Wind 20 (or somewhat less based on a few other variables). The specifications are accepted design parameters, can we exceed... sure all models probably have a variance in electronics and power reserves and generally the newer the hardware the more likely that can be exceeded.

As Pat indicated, Gusts or Velocity Effects. Require reactionary forces within the limitations of the maximum specifications and the CoD of the Aircraft. Gusts further challenge the electronics: Gyro sensitivity, ECS & Motors, GPS accuracy, FW, etc.
 
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It appears someone in the NYPD thought things through and decided drones in rain and wind wasn’t a good idea.

That was their smarter move for the year's end! ;)
I watched a bit of that last night... I fail to see the desire to stand in cold pouring rain, drink and wait for an event that will occur anyway consistently every year.
 
Past the life of this thread... but question to Admin, for the various pieces moved to "News" why wasn't this Battery Notice for DJI platform not initially moved to "News" ? :oops:
 
I watched a bit of that last night... I fail to see the desire to stand in cold pouring rain, drink and wait for an event that will occur anyway consistently every year.

In total agreement with that. Adding another insult to those injuries was a new method used to control movement, multiple “corrals” for those participating, none of which had toilet facilities. I’ll assume there’s a lot of shoes that will never be worn again.
 
In total agreement with that. Adding another insult to those injuries was a new method used to control movement, multiple “corrals” for those participating, none of which had toilet facilities. I’ll assume there’s a lot of shoes that will never be worn again.
Urrg! Nasty, I had heard that too... the portapots were limited. Haven't seen a drunk restrain if in need. That was clearly an event to watch from a warm dry living room.... plus the bed is a walk not a few hours away while soaked.
 

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