A Scary Flight after installing Remote ID Module

[Richie]

My first flight after putting the Holy Stone RID module. It flew fine for about 2 minutes then it wasnt going where I pointed it to and almost crashed into my neighbors house so I let go of the sticks to let it hover and it started flying backwards by itself. I had to fight it to get it back and because i couldnt let go of the sticks I had to hard land it at speed. With my Cat-like reflexes I kept it from crashing . Ok I just got lucky. I dont know if the RID was blocking my GPS cause it wasnt gonna hover. Then a look at the Flight Log That says I flew to the middle of Africa and back to California. IDK what happened. Im a little shook up so Im gonna rest and then figure out how to upload my flight logs to see if anyone can make heads or tails of it

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[IronSky1]

Were was the RID unit attached?

 

[DoomMeister]

My first flight after putting the Holy Stone RID module. It flew fine for about 2 minutes then it wasnt going where I pointed it to and almost crashed into my neighbors house so I let go of the sticks to let it hover and it started flying backwards by itself. I had to fight it to get it back and because i couldnt let go of the sticks I had to hard land it at speed. With my Cat-like reflexes I kept it from crashing . Ok I just got lucky. I dont know if the RID was blocking my GPS cause it wasnt gonna hover. Then a look at the Flight Log That says I flew to the middle of Africa and back to California. IDK what happened. Im a little shook up so Im gonna rest and then figure out how to upload my flight logs to see if anyone can make heads or tails of it

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Where did you mount your RID module?

I use one on my Typhoon H and have had no issues from using it. I mounted mine on top forward of the middle arms so it is well away from the GPS module.

 

[Richie]

The middle of Africa, or off the coast, South of Ghana? That would be some interesting GPS failure clues to explore, regardless of what caused it.
View attachment 30467

You can use Typhoon H Flight Log Retrieval.pdf to upload the flight logs.

By the way, LOVED the video.

 

[Richie]

Where did you mount your RID module?

I use one on my Typhoon H and have had no issues from using it. I mounted mine on top forward of the middle arms so it is well away from the GPS module.

I mounted it underneath between the light and gimbal. Im gonna try it on top. I could have just lost satilite the normal way but ive never had it fly without stabilization and flying away from me

 

[Richie]

The middle of Africa, or off the coast, South of Ghana? That would be some interesting

By the way, LOVED the video.

Heres the flight log

 

[Richie]

Were was the RID unit attached?

I had it velcroed underneath in back of the gimbal. Is that the worst place for it. The lil pamphlet says it will help boost your gps. Sounds a little funny but IDK

 

[WTFDproject]

I had it velcroed underneath in back of the gimbal. Is that the worst place for it. The lil pamphlet says it will help boost your gps. Sounds a little funny but IDK

For what it's worth, that is where my RID module is mounted and also held by velcro. It has been there for several months. No issues with GPS have been noticed. But that's just this one. Other folks and other RID module brands may have different experiences.

The better log reviewers will hopefully see your flight log post soon. I will start reviewing it now.
In the meantime, it may be very helpful if you would check your hardware monitor for stick "J3", and your final output display for Channel CH03 and report what you see. Look for smooth, repeated movements up and down, large and small, fast and slow, and always quick return to center when released. Comparing J3/CH03 to the response of the other stick channels is a good way to see any differences.

 

[DoomMeister]

I mounted it underneath between the light and gimbal. Im gonna try it on top. I could have just lost satilite the normal way but ive never had it fly without stabilization and flying away from me

As you probably noticed, without GPS the aircraft continues in the direction it is moving when the sticks are released. Without GPS you have to ‘brake’ by applying the opposite control. The aircraft also flies faster with the same amount of stick deflection because GPS computations are not taking place in the onboard F/C.

That landing was unbelievable! Thought for sure it would topple over as fast as it was moving laterally.

I’ll try to take a look at the flight log tomorrow.

 

[h-elsner]

I have a theory that may explain the behavior of the drone.
The latency between 2.4GHz RC and 5.8GHz WiFi is somewhere between 0.16s and 0.2s which is a lot when you control an aircraft. Normally it is no problem. But due to Dual band redundancy feature the drone switches to control via WiFi when the 2.4GHz connection is lost for a while. If it switches forth and back you will suffer from feel erratic flight behavior due to latency. And exactly this is happen.


From 20240412 16:40:19 on there are gaps in the 2.4GHz telemetry. Around 1min later you decide to switch off the GPS support and bring it down (red cursor). After that there are still fall-backs to WiFi which makes it hard to control the a/c, even harder when GPS is off.

Maybe there are interferences between RID and 2.4GHz RC control connection or a bad mouning place of RID module or ... I don't know.

Questions:
Is the RID module somehow connected to the drone? Power supply for example? If so a ferrite core at the wiring may help.
Do you have a 3-antenna ST16 or a 2-antenna RC? If 3-antenna RC how the 2 rod antennas are directed? Parallel or 90° to each other (should be 90°)?
Do you point the rod antennas to the drone (never do this)?

Remark: ST16 time changed 1 hour midflight because ST16 tokk time from GPS now.

 

[Richie]

If the GPS switched off, it was none of my doing. I dont think it can be switched without landingit first. I have seen a video of a guy who disabled GPS and he flew at 65 mph and thats crazy. I placed the RID behind the gimbal, in front of the rear status light, there are no electronics there but all the wiring goes thru there. It has its own lipo battery so its not connected to anything. Im not sure if it had anything to do with it. I just dont know.

Edited by Moderator to bring text into reply box.

 

[WTFDproject]

.......... I placed the RID behind the gimbal, in front of the rear status light, there are no electronics there but all the wiring goes thru there. It has its own lipo battery so its not connected to anything. Im not sure if it had anything to do with it. I just dont know.

My RID module is mounted the same as you describe yours. I did a couple of checks. I see a little difference in the signal, but not much.
Here is how I set it up:
1. For a good comparison, ensure both drone and controller are in the same place, and facing the same direction for each "flight".
2.) There is no actual flight. This is done on the ground, motors off, no camera. I haven't done other variations.
3.) Remove props.
4.) Pick a location to place the drone. Probably distance is better than walls, but each has advantages. I did one pair of checks with the Drone/controller close but separated by a heavy wall. The second pair of checks was done with about 100 ft distance between drone and camera. Either way worked, but "distance" is easier to document as a variable.
5.) Turn on Module, Drone and Controller.
6.) When GPS acquires, start motors in idle for a couple seconds (to initiate a new Flight Log), then turn motors off.
7.) Let is sit undisturbed about 15 or 20 minutes.
8.) Shut everything down.
9.) Turn the RID Module off.
10.) Restart only Drone and Controller. Start motors again for a couple seconds. Let it sit undisturbed another 15 or 20 minutes.
11.) Shut everything down.
12.) Download your flight logs and compare the rsk_fssi column of each record. Ignore the first and last minutes when you were moving around the drone/controller. Or any period when anything else may have been moving around either of them. You can also upload the Flightlogs again and we can produce images to compare your results.

If the same problems exist both with and without the RID Module, it gives more reason to look harder at some of the other issues that could have produced the same gaps in your original logs.

 

[Richie]

I think the GPS likes to shut itself off

 

[WTFDproject]

This time change thing is killing the ability to review. The second flight looks OK, but the first flight had a time change again and is a mess. You can take a look at the Date/Time and Time zone settings on the ST16 to see if anything looks strange. Maybe switch to manual time set instead of automatic.

I'm not the expert in GPS stuff. But there are a couple of observations. There were a lot of GPS dropouts while GPS Satellite count was increasing. Those don't worry me much. The interesting thing is there were NO GPS dropouts when satellite count was greater than 12 when RID was "ON". There was one GPS dropout with GPS off. GPS count was generally good around the time of the dropout, but there was a very sharp drop and return in the count at about the same time.
There is more to the story than just "count" when evaluating the quality of the GPS signal. Best to wait for those that can really discuss the subject. But the initial thought from what I see is that the RID module is not your problem.

 

[DoomMeister]

The time change occurs with the ST16 because it gets time from a WiFi connection to the internet or USB connection to a PC which will change with daylight savings. When connected to the aircraft and camera it will get time from the GPS satellites once its internal GPS gets a reliable GPS fix, and the GPS system does not use daylight savings.

If you do not wait for this to happen you will get this time anomaly when daylight savings is in effect.

There are two ways to alleviate this issue. The first is to go into the time setting for the ST16 and check to make sure it is set to standard time and not daylight savings. The second is to power up the ST16 and the aircraft and wait until you get the white flash every 3 seconds after getting GPS Ready. The white flash is letting you know the ST16 has a good GPS and can work for watch-me/follow-me. It also means that RTH will work properly to follow the position of the ST16.

I never launch until I have had the white flash for at least a minute.

 

[WTFDproject]

These are some of the channels from the Flightlog of the actual Flight 225 in the video:
The time change on the ST16 creates vertical and horizontal distortion between the segments before and after the time change. Scales were added to deal with the vertical distortion. The horizontal distortion does not cause a review problem but is noted at the bottom if needed.

 

[Richie]

The time change occurs with the ST16 because it gets time from a WiFi connection to

Cool, Thanks

 

[Yuneec Skins]

Watched your Video... Great Save !!
Not sure how you pulled that off coming in at an Angle for an Emergency Landing...
I couldn't Help but notice that your Flying in a Sea of Aluminum Sheeting...
In a Location that's probably full of Wi-Fi Traffic from your neighbors (some may argue the Aluminum work's as a Faraday Cage).
I noticed you didn't seem to have an issue until your Altitude was just above, or almost even with your neighbor's Roof Tops... That's probably the elevation where you would experience the most interference... I recommend your next Flight take place in a Wide Open Area, like a Park or Field away from; Cell Towers, Power Lines, Underground Utilities, Steel-Reinforced Concrete and Trees, with a Clear 360 Degree view of the Horizon, away from local Wi-Fi Traffic & Dwelling's with 1'000's of Square Feet of Aluminum Sheeting...
Let us know if that Render's a less eventful Flight Session...

 

[Pier2162]

And I wish add....keep you mobile phone away from your flying area, or at least in air mode, with all connections (cellular, Bluetooth and wifi) switched off.

 

[mac1520]

Watched your Video... Great Save !!
Not sure how you pulled that off coming in at an Angle for an Emergency Landing...
I couldn't Help but notice that your Flying in a Sea of Aluminum Sheeting...
In a Location that's probably full of Wi-Fi Traffic from your neighbors (some may argue the Aluminum work's as a Faraday Cage).
I noticed you didn't seem to have an issue until your Altitude was just above, or almost even with your neighbor's Roof Tops... That's probably the elevation where you would experience the most interference... I recommend your next Flight take place in a Wide Open Area, like a Park or Field away from; Cell Towers, Power Lines, Underground Utilities, Steel-Reinforced Concrete and Trees, with a Clear 360 Degree view of the Horizon, away from local Wi-Fi Traffic & Dwelling's with 1'000's of Square Feet of Aluminum Sheeting...
Let us know if that Render's a less eventful Flight Session...

Totally agree. I dont think it has anything to do with your remote id. The aluminum roof will ruin your day however messing with your GPS. I have a metal barn and used the Typhoon H to inspect the roof to troubleshoot a leak. As soon as i got within a few of the roof feet, she went nuts… started spinning and doing crazy stuff… managed to pull her out of it and realized how luck I was not to crash. Metal and gps signals do not mix well.