I think you should take up your fight with Yuneec. Save your strength. I'm out of this conversation.
Crash- major malfunction
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I don't expect a fight from Yuneec. It's always the same MO. MUST be pilot error. The DJI forums are the same way.
If I screwed up, I would be the first to admit it. Nobody has yet demonstrated from Yuneec anywhere that specifically or implicitly states to be 10 ft. off the ground before using Journey mode.
**** right I'm mad. The camera failed in May (had it 2 days); no H for Memorial Weekend. Now a fatal crash; scratch July 4 video trip up north. So now if Yuneec repairs this thing, it's like owning a car that's been flood damaged IMO.
That's it, I'm done too, unless someone else wants to argue.
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The thought of needing to "exit" didn't come to mind because there was no obstructions behind the copter except a 4 ft. high fence a good 75 ft. away or more.
There is no switch that is not GPS dependent. Switching from Smart to Angle to RTH will help nothing if there is a GPS glitch. Before takeoff is the only time you can switch GPS off and fly. My first thought was it GPS glitch or barometer error. As such simply turning off Journey did not occur to me. Gaining back control when a GPS glitch is suspected in my book means no GPS assist.
I did not adjust the angle of the camera because getting video wasn't important. I only wanted to test the flight mode and landed after POI so the camera was facing me. .
The copter yawed 180 degrees and did not fly as fast either. When it reached the end, it yawed 180 degrees again but returned at a steeper angle then crashed long before the starting position. It clearly shows this on Exmaps.
This is from the ST16:
10 ft. away? I was ~15 ft away. It says nothing about being 10 ft high. What if you're on a hill or steps that is 10 ft. higher than you and you're 30 ft away but the ground behind that is at a slight angle upward?
I don't care which way one looks at this, it is a major malfunction both in the instructions and code. If the ascent angle is based on the camera angle relative to gravity and the craft needs to be in the air 10 ft. high, it should say that. All it says is the camera cannot be adjusted once in Journey mode.
The assent angle is based on the craft and controller not the camera, it's up to you to point camera at yourself for a selfie mode feature. Even the pic from the controller shows the H up in the air not on the ground. I don't quite follow how you can be " What if you're on a hill or steps that is 10 ft. higher than you " How can you be higher than you, I'm not following this hypothetical? I don't get why you're bringing in a possible gps glitch. That comment about switching modes was for the other poster in reference to re-gaining control sorry for not being clear. When I tested the journey mode I was alarmed at it coming back at me so fast and I hit exit and it instantly stopped. That required me taking my eyes off the H and frantically looking for the stop button
I think had you intended to actual film a selfie you may not have had this experience because you would've lined the camera up etc as I've never seen a selfie start from someones feet unless they wanted a footie but that's water under the bridge. Seriously I'm not trying to be a jerk about this but you have some responsibility in what happened imo. Like I previously stated a warning about incorrect angle or simply have that mode not work unless H is in the air. Sorry this happened to you and I hope you get it sorted out.Should the controller have warned you that this was a bad move? Yes.
Should you have flipped the flight mode switch or canceled out of Journey on the controller? Yes.
You might have a case because it let you do something that it shouldn't. Basically your argument will have to be that the manual isn't clear and no one wrote the logic in the program to save you from yourself.
I imagine there will be many more reports of this sort of thing as more functions are automated. It's very difficult to come up with every possible failure mode sitting around a table. I wouldn't have thought to suggest "Hey, what about the guy that tries to set up a selfie of his shins?" either.
I can't wait for the first reports of people trying to have the H follow them on mountain bike trails with the Realsense module as was demonstrated by Yuneec on their staged course
Should you have flipped the flight mode switch or canceled out of Journey on the controller? Yes.
You might have a case because it let you do something that it shouldn't. Basically your argument will have to be that the manual isn't clear and no one wrote the logic in the program to save you from yourself.
I imagine there will be many more reports of this sort of thing as more functions are automated. It's very difficult to come up with every possible failure mode sitting around a table. I wouldn't have thought to suggest "Hey, what about the guy that tries to set up a selfie of his shins?" either.
I can't wait for the first reports of people trying to have the H follow them on mountain bike trails with the Realsense module as was demonstrated by Yuneec on their staged course
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In fairness to Yuneec they do make you read the 3 screens in the photos below, before you can attempt the journey mode.
It's not just the ground you need to be aware of it's everything in the proposed direction of travel and it is well explained in which direction the H will fly once you swipe the final start switch.
It's maybe a little disingenuous to call the title of this thread "crash-major-malfunction" as if you had carefully read the screens they put in-front of you before you executed the manoeuvre you probably would have understood that you were about to try and fly back level with the ground. (It is possible to edit the title
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So it is the camera angle, my bad I thought is was controller and craft angle. Come on glider we need to get this to a third page
I'm waiting to see a video of 2 drones with Roman candles attached to legs having a dog fight! It's probably happened. I did see video of phantom shooting Roman candles at people on the ground. People are nuts.
I'm waiting to see a video of 2 drones with Roman candles attached to legs having a dog fight! It's probably happened. I did see video of phantom shooting Roman candles at people on the ground. People are nuts.
In fairness to Yuneec they do make you read the 3 screens in the photos below, before you can attempt the journey mode.
It's not just the ground you need to be aware of it's everything in the proposed direction of travel and it is well explained in which direction the H will fly once you swipe the final start switch.
It's maybe a little disingenuous to call the title of this thread "crash-major-malfunction" as if you had carefully read the screens they put in-front of you before you executed the manoeuvre you probably would have understood that you were about to try and fly back level with the ground. (It is possible to edit the title
I've already been through this.
Does it say first fly the Typhoon H 10 ft. high? No.
Does it say anything anywhere about the need to be in the air to run in Journey mode? No. If so show me.
Does it say the camera angle determines the angle of ascent and descent? No.
Does it say the H will go UP, OUT and RETURN? Yes.
Have there been multiple complaints about Typhoon H documentation on this forum? Yes.
Does the ST16 show a picture with the camera level to gravity? Yes
The copter did a 180 on takeoff after bouncing around and hovering. It did not respond to effort to kill the motors. It did not move at normal Journey speed to the waypoint at 5 ft. max height. It then did another 180 and returned at a steeper descent than ascent and crashed well before the starting point.
It did not go UP (barely left the ground) and OUT and did not RETURN correctly.
In Arducopter if determined to be a true event, the devs would investigate, replicate, issue a warning if confirmed and fix asap. It would be classified as a major bug in the code with 100% certainty it caused a crash. I don't feel the need to defend poorly written code and instructions no matter how much I like the H which I will not not have for another 2-4 weeks.
This is the way it should work:
1) problem discovered, rule out hardware failure/conflicts
2) problem replicated
3) problem acknowledged
4) solution offered
5) solution tested
6) issue update
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It's not a problem for me or many others, it's just you missed the part where it says "Dependant on the camera tilt, the drone will go up and out".
You see, it's critical the tilt of the camera to the direction the drone will fly. To illustrate this, they also make nice pictures of the direction the drone will fly at various angles.
It stands to reason if you hover the drone 1 meter off the ground or even lower or even landed and you instruct it to fly back at the angel as shown in the images that the results will be bad. (I guess Yuneec assume that you have a little common sense).
You said, "Does it say the camera angle determines the angle of ascent and descent? No."
It does say this on the second screen you swiped through without understanding.
You have also said you would put your hand up if you were wrong so you are wrong in this instance at least?
You need to take some responsibility for this and not blame it on your expectations of how something from another manufacture is programmed.
Yuneec did make it black and white, just looking at that 1st image in the second screen you have to read, of the orange arrow parallel to the ground, this must have raised alarm bells for you that parallel flight was a possibility and maybe it's better not to assume it's an Arducoptor. "Dependant on the camera tilt, the drone will go up and out"
( "Does the ST16 show a picture with the camera level to gravity? Yes"...level to gravity ? anyway...you need to look at the full picture not just a crop of one area, all will become clear ))
Sorry man, I don't see you putting your hand up for your faults...so I'm outa this convo.
You see, it's critical the tilt of the camera to the direction the drone will fly. To illustrate this, they also make nice pictures of the direction the drone will fly at various angles.
It stands to reason if you hover the drone 1 meter off the ground or even lower or even landed and you instruct it to fly back at the angel as shown in the images that the results will be bad. (I guess Yuneec assume that you have a little common sense).
You said, "Does it say the camera angle determines the angle of ascent and descent? No."
It does say this on the second screen you swiped through without understanding.
You have also said you would put your hand up if you were wrong so you are wrong in this instance at least?
You need to take some responsibility for this and not blame it on your expectations of how something from another manufacture is programmed.
Yuneec did make it black and white, just looking at that 1st image in the second screen you have to read, of the orange arrow parallel to the ground, this must have raised alarm bells for you that parallel flight was a possibility and maybe it's better not to assume it's an Arducoptor. "Dependant on the camera tilt, the drone will go up and out"
( "Does the ST16 show a picture with the camera level to gravity? Yes"...level to gravity ? anyway...you need to look at the full picture not just a crop of one area, all will become clear ))
Sorry man, I don't see you putting your hand up for your faults...so I'm outa this convo.
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It has to be in the air in order to enable a selfie. The camera must point at your face, which it can't do from the ground. The camera can be level to the earth if it is at the height of your face, or angled downward if higher. The direction of travel is determined by the camera angle, to keep the subject in frame. The assumption is that the subject is a face, and the face is above the ground.
The directions talk around it, but the point is the mode generates a selfie without facial recognition, meaning it starts and stops from a point that is supposed to be at or above face level. It can't tell from what's in frame, only based on assumptions of the intent of the mode and that faces are above ground level most of the time.
The directions talk around it, but the point is the mode generates a selfie without facial recognition, meaning it starts and stops from a point that is supposed to be at or above face level. It can't tell from what's in frame, only based on assumptions of the intent of the mode and that faces are above ground level most of the time.
Some here are no different than the DJI cracked arm/flyaway,drop-from-the-sky deniers. Nitpicking, obfuscating and poo poo all negative reports. I started a moderated blog at RCG to stop DJI sycophants (including paid employees) from controlling the narrative, so the responses aren't that surprising.
The copter should go UP, OUT and RETURN to where it started to go OUT. It doesn't mean it necessarily must land because it doesn't say it will land, but it should not try to go under the ground less than half the distance back.
This was either a glitch in the hardware or there is a bug in the firmware for Journey mode. Why did it rotate 180 degrees at both ends of the flight?
Here is my flight from Exmaps slowed 4x (Exmaps speeds up 5x). FF to 1:00. The movement prior to takeoff is GPS error, not me moving the copter around.
APM Dronie from 2014. It has since been updated, but the instructions are unambiguous:
The copter should go UP, OUT and RETURN to where it started to go OUT. It doesn't mean it necessarily must land because it doesn't say it will land, but it should not try to go under the ground less than half the distance back.
This was either a glitch in the hardware or there is a bug in the firmware for Journey mode. Why did it rotate 180 degrees at both ends of the flight?
Here is my flight from Exmaps slowed 4x (Exmaps speeds up 5x). FF to 1:00. The movement prior to takeoff is GPS error, not me moving the copter around.
APM Dronie from 2014. It has since been updated, but the instructions are unambiguous:
To set up the dronie, place the drone 8m away, facing you, and make sure that the path you’re facing has at least 100m of clearance (about a football field). The copter will automatically take off and go back 50m and up 30m from its initial location.
Turn on your controller and keep the throttle stick down; this is in case of an emergency. When your copter and camera are ready, connect the 3DR radio to your Android device and open Droidplanner. Hit Connect. Next you’ll see two buttons: Dronie and Arm. Press Dronie to set up the flight path. The map will update with the path plan and a warning to stand back from the drone. Now hit Arm.
When you’re ready to go, press Auto. The drone will take off, turn the camera towards you and fly back and up. When it reaches its peak at 50m out and 30m up, it will return to land and disarm.
Turn on your controller and keep the throttle stick down; this is in case of an emergency. When your copter and camera are ready, connect the 3DR radio to your Android device and open Droidplanner. Hit Connect. Next you’ll see two buttons: Dronie and Arm. Press Dronie to set up the flight path. The map will update with the path plan and a warning to stand back from the drone. Now hit Arm.
When you’re ready to go, press Auto. The drone will take off, turn the camera towards you and fly back and up. When it reaches its peak at 50m out and 30m up, it will return to land and disarm.
There's definitely an issue in that it allowed this to happen from the ground, especially since even if the intent was to start from the ground, it's going to crash eventually just from fairly minor inaccuracies in positioning. Also likely why they say a minimum of ten feet to start with, otherwise at some point you'll take a rotor to the face upon return if you are any closer and the gps is off slightly, fully reliant on the sonar stopping it. The mode all around doesn't seem useful enough for the potential issues that most people will ignore thinking it's automated and a "smart" process.
It's not said anywhere it's a "smart" process. All anyone has to do to use it is to read the instructions. All of them - the ones in the manual and the the ones one the screen. It so obvious what it going to happen if you do this from the ground with ground behind you.
It possible to fly this mode from the ground level or at any level (the instruction is given to have the camera pointing at you before you start and this angel sets the angel the copter will fly away from you at) it is like this because you might want to put the copter 10ft out from you from the top of a building or the top cliff. This can make a nice shot. (The copter rotates in either direction to fly with its forward and aft nav lights in the correct direction, this is immaterial to the performance of the mode) Do you have a H?
Preordering a pro, joined to get info.
The assumption will be a "smart" process for a lot of people, and assumptions cause catastrophic events just as much as actual product failure.
The assumption will be a "smart" process for a lot of people, and assumptions cause catastrophic events just as much as actual product failure.
So you could put it directly above your head 10 ft. or above the subject (eg 10 ft away from ST16, 10 ft above) and aim the camera straight down 90 degrees (which the picture above shows), have it fly straight up and return when it is well known the barometer can accumulate AGL estimate errors > 20 ft. after takeoff. That's why I let the copter acclimate for at least 5 minutes or longer before even thinking of taking off. GPS errors are known to be worse, so the barometer needs to be accurate.
This is my last post on the matter until hearing from Yuneec.*
* I reserve the right to modify that pledge
Didn't notice this post.
CCC is a "smart" process designed to allow the pilot to focus using the camera rather than, to use the analogy, juggling balls while flying. If any part of that process fails, it can cause catastrophic events. If the pilot can never trust anything will work right, there's no sense in having these technological wonders and go back to 72's and servo's or fly-by-wires and stick to AMA fields.
My view is, if I don't have confidence in my machines to fly over water because "something" could happen, I shouldn't be in the hobby. There's risk in everything and nothing is perfect.
Exactly, not reading the instructions and making assumptions will obviously lead to bad results, the smartness of this mode is only smart as defined by it's instructions - which do work.
After 3 days they did not contact me, so I had to call back earlier today. That person wanted to review the firmware installed, but I didn't have the copter, so had to call back. The next person tonight was very argumentative and flat out told me crashes are not covered. So all you folks that "Yuneec came through for" should feel lucky. They did not even look at the logs I sent, so had to resend.
It's as if CS has been issued a cease and desist order and Yuneec's "crash" fund has run dry.
Anyone, show me where it says Journey mode cannot be used when on the ground. I've had two different flight control systems that do either from ground or air. A good flight controller would not allow an event like this to occur if it isn't supposed to happen.
Does this picture show the 10 ft. distance "away" in the air or taking off from the ground? Nobody has yet to produce one document that states the H is unable to start Journey Mode from the ground.Smart Circle my ***.
All I will say is based on the conversation tonight (without them even looking at the log) my demeanor will change very quickly and all the defending of Yuneec at RCG will have been for no reason. It looks like the camera/gimbal is damaged. If that's the case and Yuneec will not work with me, it's a big turnaround from what Yuneec has been doing for many, many others.There is no sense at that point to fix it even out of pocket.
Caveat emptor.
EDIT: I asked where in the instructions it states Journey Mode cannot be started from the ground. The only answer was "crashes are not covered by warranty". I'm trying to imagine what good the warranty is then. Maybe a light burns out or landing gear fails to go down while landing......oops that means a high likelihood of crashing.
It's as if CS has been issued a cease and desist order and Yuneec's "crash" fund has run dry.
Anyone, show me where it says Journey mode cannot be used when on the ground. I've had two different flight control systems that do either from ground or air. A good flight controller would not allow an event like this to occur if it isn't supposed to happen.
Does this picture show the 10 ft. distance "away" in the air or taking off from the ground? Nobody has yet to produce one document that states the H is unable to start Journey Mode from the ground.Smart Circle my ***.
All I will say is based on the conversation tonight (without them even looking at the log) my demeanor will change very quickly and all the defending of Yuneec at RCG will have been for no reason. It looks like the camera/gimbal is damaged. If that's the case and Yuneec will not work with me, it's a big turnaround from what Yuneec has been doing for many, many others.There is no sense at that point to fix it even out of pocket.
Caveat emptor.
EDIT: I asked where in the instructions it states Journey Mode cannot be started from the ground. The only answer was "crashes are not covered by warranty". I'm trying to imagine what good the warranty is then. Maybe a light burns out or landing gear fails to go down while landing......oops that means a high likelihood of crashing.
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That's a really terrible response, all crashes, no matter the reason? That doesn't make any sense.
Your argument isn't going to work. Show me where it says start journey mode from the ground. Show me a video of the H doing journey mode from the ground. It doesn't say you can't start CCC from a tree so that means if you do and something goes wrong it's yuneec fault? This type of argument won't work. I'm exaggerating but you aren't picking up that members are telling you they think it's your fault or have some responsibility in the crash. You've blamed everything but yourself. We all feel your pain but it's your responsibility to know not guess how the craft flies in different modes. An on screen warning would've been nice but things went wrong and you didn't react according to the instructions on exiting that flight mode. Show me where it says hit the red button to exit journey mode. Now your blaming CS when historically they've been pretty dang good for most people. Do you think there's even the slightest chance it's your fault and that's why they're treating you that way? Saying it didn't say you couldn't do something is a very ineffective argument/excuse. I do sympathise with you on your crash and hope you can get flying again.
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