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Typhoon H - Loss of Control - Crash -Telemetry Data

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Hello all,

We are a commercial operator with multiple pilots and a wide variety of aircraft. We have been flying this H for 14 months or so with only minor issues (mainly pilots tipping it on landing). Last week, one of our newer pilots had one of our H's fly off uncontrolled on the second flight of the day. In his words it took off fine but then flew off on its own. He claims to have done a compass calibration and my limited investigation skills with the telemetry data back this up. He also believes the aircraft did respond when he put it in Return to Home Mode but that after it reversed direction it flew a short ways and went into a tree barely missed on its free flight trying to leave town... He said it looked like it was following the same path in reverse

What I would like to do it get more info on the telemetry data specifics. I need a decoder ring so I can verify a few things. I did find one document (made for the 4 blade Typhoon) on this forum that had several details and explained many of the parameters but was missing a key item, specifically the position of the collision avoidance switch.

My concerns are that that the aircraft did not ascend to the return to home altitude and the obstacle avoidance did not avoid the trees. I am unsure of the Obstacle Avoidance switch position so that could be all on the pilot but the return to home altitude should have been ok. It is on our checklist and I was able to verify that it was still set at our standard height. there would be no reason for him to change this. From what I could see, there were some odd responses from the radios "rssi" (which typically stands for Received Signal Strength Indicator in the RF world). It would bounce from a normal signal -33 for example to 0, every several measurement cycles which I assume is no reading at all or an error because it would not go to exactly 0 over and over again. the start of this behavior on the timeline does match when the aircraft started to fly away.

I also found some errors or unusual responses from one parameter that should be compass errors according to the notes I found. So my thoughts are a compass failure, which fits my pilots description of how it was flying away forward, sideways, forward etc.

I would like to find out the different ways people review the flight log files. I was able to piece a story together based on excel pivot tables and charts but there has to be a better way. I found an app out there but I no longer have the controller and it looked like that app was designed to be used on the tablet/ST16
I understand there is a warranty period for all things but man that sure is frustrating if this turns out to be an equipment failure. I put a screen shot of the data below. sorry if its too small to read...

That's enough for now.

To summarize my questions,
1. Is there any documentation on telemetry parameters with detailed descriptions so we can diagnose the log files?
2. What are the "best" or more common apps used to review the telemetry data or visualize it?

Thanks in advancescreen shot of graph.jpg
 
Thank you. Does the GUI provide some way to review log files?
I cannot download or install this version (says virus). I do have some older version of the GUI on my desktop but I do not know which version...

The UAV Toolbox looks helpful but we no longer have the controller on hand.

Thanks again
 
I stand corrected... I thought you could review telemetry files in the GUI, but that is not the case. So where are you getting the telemetry data from if you no longer have the ST-16?
 
If you have the telemetry file you can add .txt to it and post the files here and someone can probably take a look at it for you. As to weather the Obstacle Avoidance was on or not, I have not seen any software that indicates that, however the Status of Compass, IMU, GPS, and which FlightMode the craft was in as well as any error flags can be read.
 
Sorry I got distracted and forgot to reply to this tread, my apologies. Thank you for the input so far. I had the pilot send me the 4 log files that he pulled and I just played with them in excel.

I will try and upload the files in a bit and any help would be greatly appreciated. We sent this aircraft, controller and camera through the Yuneec RA process to Kansas (Ken-A-Vision?) for a repair estimate. It came back reasonably priced at $280 but there is no GPS, Compass etc. and no notes that any of this was even tested. I called them and they are now going to "review" the case. I wonder if because the aircraft is just outside of the warranty and it was submitted as "Out of Warranty" they may not do diagnostics? It sounded like this should have been done by Yuneec before it was submitted as an RA to Kansas.

Thanks again
 
Here are the files. I changed the file name as requested. There is also a "Sensor.bin" file, is that needed? I could not find much info on that in my limited search.

My concern is putting this machine back into service with bad system still on board. If I can learn more about what happened, maybe I can convince Yuneec to dig deeper and diagnose to make sure there is not a problem. I do not know anything about the repair facility in Kansas to know if their capable of testing and determining the status of these systems? do any of you know if they are?

Thanks again for any insight you can provide.
 

Attachments

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  • RemoteGPS_00184.txt
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  • Telemetry_00184.txt
    293.5 KB · Views: 13
Hello all,

We are a commercial operator with multiple pilots and a wide variety of aircraft. We have been flying this H for 14 months or so with only minor issues (mainly pilots tipping it on landing). Last week, one of our newer pilots had one of our H's fly off uncontrolled on the second flight of the day. In his words it took off fine but then flew off on its own. He claims to have done a compass calibration and my limited investigation skills with the telemetry data back this up. He also believes the aircraft did respond when he put it in Return to Home Mode but that after it reversed direction it flew a short ways and went into a tree barely missed on its free flight trying to leave town... He said it looked like it was following the same path in reverse

What I would like to do it get more info on the telemetry data specifics. I need a decoder ring so I can verify a few things. I did find one document (made for the 4 blade Typhoon) on this forum that had several details and explained many of the parameters but was missing a key item, specifically the position of the collision avoidance switch.

My concerns are that that the aircraft did not ascend to the return to home altitude and the obstacle avoidance did not avoid the trees. I am unsure of the Obstacle Avoidance switch position so that could be all on the pilot but the return to home altitude should have been ok. It is on our checklist and I was able to verify that it was still set at our standard height. there would be no reason for him to change this. From what I could see, there were some odd responses from the radios "rssi" (which typically stands for Received Signal Strength Indicator in the RF world). It would bounce from a normal signal -33 for example to 0, every several measurement cycles which I assume is no reading at all or an error because it would not go to exactly 0 over and over again. the start of this behavior on the timeline does match when the aircraft started to fly away.

I also found some errors or unusual responses from one parameter that should be compass errors according to the notes I found. So my thoughts are a compass failure, which fits my pilots description of how it was flying away forward, sideways, forward etc.

I would like to find out the different ways people review the flight log files. I was able to piece a story together based on excel pivot tables and charts but there has to be a better way. I found an app out there but I no longer have the controller and it looked like that app was designed to be used on the tablet/ST16
I understand there is a warranty period for all things but man that sure is frustrating if this turns out to be an equipment failure. I put a screen shot of the data below. sorry if its too small to read...

That's enough for now.

To summarize my questions,
1. Is there any documentation on telemetry parameters with detailed descriptions so we can diagnose the log files?
2. What are the "best" or more common apps used to review the telemetry data or visualize it?

Thanks in advanceView attachment 7662

I am not a seasoned pilot but I also had a loss of control situation resulting in a crash. I was bringing my drone home when it started to not respond to my commands. I finally got it back but lost all control and all it would do is hover about 25 ft. above me and nothing I did regained control. It slowly drifted into a wall and fell to the ground. I returned it to Yuneec with a detailed letter as to what happened. Yuneec analyzed the telemetry three times and came up with the same conclusion each time. They concluded that I flew it into the ground which is totally opposite as to what actually occurred. I can only conclude that they were trying to avoid fixing a warranty repair or maybe the telemetry data is not as reliable as we are told it is.
As I read pilots stories of crashes that occurred because of a loss of control I have to wonder if our Typhoon H's have a software issue and Yuneec is doing everything they can to distance themselves from the problem. They certainly did in my case.
 
If Yuneec was having software issues wouldn't this be an issue with all H's? I thought I had read somewhere Yuneec is using Russian Satellites to lock on?
 
I know just enough to be dangerous and you may have a good point. What I do know is that the conclusion Yuneec came to after analyzing my telemetry wasn't even close as to what actually happened.
Yesterday after the tech. told me that telemetry showed I flew it into the ground and they wouldn't cover any repairs under the warranty, I ask him a question. I ask, lets assume that what I described actually occurred, what could I have done to get the drone to stop the hover and land? He said if the drone actually did what I described there was nothing I could have done. Not the answer I wanted.
 
Last edited:
I am glad you wrote this because it reminded me to update my situation and look for a way to escalate or quickly resolve my situation.

The response we got back from the repair center was "pilot error" and their description, or interpretation of the logs was very different from what myself and others found and very different from what the pilot tells me happened. Different enough that I can only think they were reviewing the wrong files. I did try to ask them to review again but they simply replied with the same answer.

To make matters worse, even though they say they flight tested the unit it arrived back to us with a dead arm. I called them right away and they said they would have someone call first thing in the morning. At 3:30 pm the following day they contacted me. I told them again that every day counts and he asked me to send the log files so they can review. Here we go again I am afraid...

I am trying hard to keep Yuneec aircraft a part of our fleet because I feel they do have benefits and advantages in many situations. However, situations like this make it increasingly difficult.

I am not sure what to do at this point.
 
From the majority of posts I have seen on Ken-A-Vision, I would not have agreed to send your H to them, especially if this is an out of warranty repair. You will get superior service and responsive communication from Carolina Dronz. This is based on my own experience with Carolina Dronz and their service department.

With the aircraft currently at KAV, you have to decide which is more important... time saved by getting the repair done by them (since it's already there), and risk whether the H is competently repaired or not; or declining the estimate and having it returned to you, to be subsequently sent one of these other repair facilities.

I feel your pain on the time involved... a warranty covered crash I had in May, took just under three months to be repaired by Yuneec.
 
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Not what I wanted to hear but sense I had already spent $65.00 to send it to them I thought the best option was to let them repair it. They have already had my drone for almost 6 months while I tried to resolve the warranty issue which I lost. Their telemetry analyzes was completely opposite from what actually occurred and their management refused to talk to me about it. I hope they do a better repair job for me than they did for you. This makes me wonder if all the rumors floating around about Yuneec filing for bankruptcy might be true. I can't imagine a company treating customers like this if they plain on staying in business.
 
I am embarrassed suit to say I didn’t even think of those other options. We were hoping they would see it was not user error and maybe cover it. Once we learned it would be out of warranty I never even thought about using a different service provider. I didn’t have much time to dedicate to this issue and thought this would be quicker. I also wanted the ability to say it was repaired by the manufacture. Lesson learned I guess.

Also I should’ve been more clear we do have possession of the aircraft now. It arrived back on Monday and it was during the initial flight attempts that we realized we had a bad arm (motor or esc maybe). Now I feel I am in a real bind because I need to rely on the same people to fix it quickly. If they agree to fix it at all. My guess is that this motor or ESC was borderline after the crash And they just didn’t catch it. I do not know what to think about their claim that they flew the aircraft after repairs were done.

The worst part is I love Carolina Dronz - Frank and would have happily use them and I thought of it. He has been very good to me several times.
 
I do not know what to think about their claim that they flew the aircraft after repairs were done.

Completely understand that too... the tail end of my own repair saga is this...

Got the H back from repairs finally in late August, Yuneec's repair tech notes said, "flies great!" Which is true as they seem to have repaired the bird back to original flying specs... however since I had previously had installed a PixAero 3.77 lens (at Carolina Dronz), they apparently did not make adjustments to the lens when repairing / re-assembling the CGO3+, since that was no longer a OEM part covered under warranty. I completely understand that, but they also did not bother to check footage when test flying the H... or if they did test, they did not report an issue to me.

So after about six weeks or so of flying to get used to the bird again, I finally decided to do some shooting and checking footage / photos, only to find a definite softness on the right side of the frame. So I subsequently sent the camera back to Carolina Dronz for re-alignment of the lens. Frank and crew did it in 3 weeks for under $30.00.
 
If you have the telemetry file you can add .txt to it and post the files here and someone can probably take a look at it for you. As to weather the Obstacle Avoidance was on or not, I have not seen any software that indicates that, however the Status of Compass, IMU, GPS, and which FlightMode the craft was in as well as any error flags can be read.

When you say add .txt, do you mean .txt or .xls.txt
 
I sent my Typhoon H to Yuneec last July for what should have been a warranty repair. After arguing with them for five months I finally gave in, paid their ransom and got the H back last week. I haven't flown it yet and am almost afraid to. What they said the telemetry showed is no where close as to what actually occurred and caused the crash. I asked the tech. just assuming my description of what occurred is correct what could I do if it happen again and his answer was I don't know.
What occurred is while bring the H back it started to respond slower and slower to my commands to the point that when I did manage to get it back it quit responding to any of my commands and just hovered at about 30 ft. While I tried everything I could think of to regain control I watched it slowly drift into the side of a building shearing off 2 props and crashing to the ground.
Has anyone had this problem and if so how did you get out of it. I tried regaining control using all three flight modes to no avail.
 
Got a survey from the Yuneec repair shop yesterday. I used the survey to very professionally explain how poorly I thought they handled what should have been a routine warranty repair issue. I assume I won't here anything from them.
 
Hello all,

We are a commercial operator with multiple pilots and a wide variety of aircraft. We have been flying this H for 14 months or so with only minor issues (mainly pilots tipping it on landing). Last week, one of our newer pilots had one of our H's fly off uncontrolled on the second flight of the day. In his words it took off fine but then flew off on its own. He claims to have done a compass calibration and my limited investigation skills with the telemetry data back this up. He also believes the aircraft did respond when he put it in Return to Home Mode but that after it reversed direction it flew a short ways and went into a tree barely missed on its free flight trying to leave town... He said it looked like it was following the same path in reverse

What I would like to do it get more info on the telemetry data specifics. I need a decoder ring so I can verify a few things. I did find one document (made for the 4 blade Typhoon) on this forum that had several details and explained many of the parameters but was missing a key item, specifically the position of the collision avoidance switch.

My concerns are that that the aircraft did not ascend to the return to home altitude and the obstacle avoidance did not avoid the trees. I am unsure of the Obstacle Avoidance switch position so that could be all on the pilot but the return to home altitude should have been ok. It is on our checklist and I was able to verify that it was still set at our standard height. there would be no reason for him to change this. From what I could see, there were some odd responses from the radios "rssi" (which typically stands for Received Signal Strength Indicator in the RF world). It would bounce from a normal signal -33 for example to 0, every several measurement cycles which I assume is no reading at all or an error because it would not go to exactly 0 over and over again. the start of this behavior on the timeline does match when the aircraft started to fly away.

I also found some errors or unusual responses from one parameter that should be compass errors according to the notes I found. So my thoughts are a compass failure, which fits my pilots description of how it was flying away forward, sideways, forward etc.

I would like to find out the different ways people review the flight log files. I was able to piece a story together based on excel pivot tables and charts but there has to be a better way. I found an app out there but I no longer have the controller and it looked like that app was designed to be used on the tablet/ST16
I understand there is a warranty period for all things but man that sure is frustrating if this turns out to be an equipment failure. I put a screen shot of the data below. sorry if its too small to read...

That's enough for now.

To summarize my questions,
1. Is there any documentation on telemetry parameters with detailed descriptions so we can diagnose the log files?
2. What are the "best" or more common apps used to review the telemetry data or visualize it?

Thanks in advanceView attachment 7662
CTOMS Is this a spreadsheet you created? Very impressive....
 

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